I’m trying to compare folded basshorns. I’d have a crack at designing a straight horn, but no way a folded horn.
Most are overkill in dB for the home.
For “audiophiles” who want dynamics, rather than trance music fans – suggestions for the * most “musical” basshorn c. 40 to 100 Hz* would be appreciated.
Several have enough output ~ but what is the smoothest and eg able to play both electric and non electric instruments eg double bass in a natural non fatiguing way?
I’ve found (in no particular order):
- LABhorn (of the different versions Brad Litz's supposedly has more output 30-60 Hz)?
- Wayne’s 12 Pi using the same LABhorn drivers? www.audioroundtable.com/PiSpeakers/messages/17387.html (mark 2 being developed now)
- Loudspeakerguru aka Jeff Robinson’s single LABhorn driver www.geocities.com/loudspeakerguru/DWG58.gif Very interesting folding, but has anyone heard what it sounds like?
From Bruce Edgar:
- the 1986 Monolith
- 1988 Show Horn (12 JPGs at www.volvotreter.de/dl-section.htm) EVM12L based (luckily there’s a B&C driver with very similar specs), or
- centre channel horn that exhausts on the floor (briefly outlined at www.positive-feedback.com/Issue4/edgarinterview.htm 75% of the way down). Has he done a more recent basshorn??
- the 186 www.speakerplans.com/index.php?id=hornplans ?
- Bill FitzM's Tuba 24, 24 Slim or Table Tuba www.billfitzmaurice.com/plans/product_info.php/manufacturers_id//products_id/23 ?
- a Khorn (Klipschorn corner horn reproduction)??
Most talk is about how loud they go, but
~ which should have the best chance of sounding good?
Are any of them available in CAD files that you can take to a computer-based woodcutter for the many difficult shapes ???
Only Edgar to my knowledge was interested in good reproduction in the home, so maybe ? the Show Horn with a replacement B&C driver??
Thanks!
Richard
Most are overkill in dB for the home.
For “audiophiles” who want dynamics, rather than trance music fans – suggestions for the * most “musical” basshorn c. 40 to 100 Hz* would be appreciated.
Several have enough output ~ but what is the smoothest and eg able to play both electric and non electric instruments eg double bass in a natural non fatiguing way?
I’ve found (in no particular order):
- LABhorn (of the different versions Brad Litz's supposedly has more output 30-60 Hz)?
- Wayne’s 12 Pi using the same LABhorn drivers? www.audioroundtable.com/PiSpeakers/messages/17387.html (mark 2 being developed now)
- Loudspeakerguru aka Jeff Robinson’s single LABhorn driver www.geocities.com/loudspeakerguru/DWG58.gif Very interesting folding, but has anyone heard what it sounds like?
From Bruce Edgar:
- the 1986 Monolith
- 1988 Show Horn (12 JPGs at www.volvotreter.de/dl-section.htm) EVM12L based (luckily there’s a B&C driver with very similar specs), or
- centre channel horn that exhausts on the floor (briefly outlined at www.positive-feedback.com/Issue4/edgarinterview.htm 75% of the way down). Has he done a more recent basshorn??
- the 186 www.speakerplans.com/index.php?id=hornplans ?
- Bill FitzM's Tuba 24, 24 Slim or Table Tuba www.billfitzmaurice.com/plans/product_info.php/manufacturers_id//products_id/23 ?
- a Khorn (Klipschorn corner horn reproduction)??
Most talk is about how loud they go, but
~ which should have the best chance of sounding good?
Are any of them available in CAD files that you can take to a computer-based woodcutter for the many difficult shapes ???
Only Edgar to my knowledge was interested in good reproduction in the home, so maybe ? the Show Horn with a replacement B&C driver??
Thanks!
Richard
You need to build a horn like that for your room to load in your room - Any other way is mostly a compromise.
Hi Magnetar
Ok, it won't be small, that's ok: I’m not wanting to bend the laws of physics.
The LABhorn may be the best optimised driver – horn, but that doesn’t mean it sounds the nicest.
Would you suggest any over the rest?
Ok, it won't be small, that's ok: I’m not wanting to bend the laws of physics.
The LABhorn may be the best optimised driver – horn, but that doesn’t mean it sounds the nicest.
Would you suggest any over the rest?
rick57 said:
With a bass horn it's best to use the law of physics for better compromises.
What size room do you have? What is the floor, walls and ceiling constructed of? Do you have solid corners? How much room in the corners? Where will be the midbass horns in relation to the subhorns in the room?
Which midbass horns will you be using? How many horns to cover 40-100 ? What amplifier, crossover to drive them? Why not go lower? A better solution may be 25-35 Hz horns used up to 60-80 Hz.
What is your time, space, and construction budget?
Will you make the horn out of plywood, brick, or concrete? Do you want the horns to be permanent?
Knowing the answers to the above questions will help you make the right choices for the least compromised bass quality in your room.
The'Lab horn' is horn designed for extermely high output and should be used in multiple stacks. They are really only arounf 95 db sensitive at 40 cycles when used alone. It is not the 'best' - the best is full size solid horns built into the room. What you could do is use three or four of them and couple them to the corners to get a much more linear output. Placement is ultra critical with small horns like the Lab Horn.
Hi Magnetar
> the best is full size solid horns built into the room.
I was staring to lean that way.
What you could do is use three or four of them and couple them to the corners to get a much more linear output.
Ouch, budget won’t stretch above one.
> Placement is ultra critical with small horns like the Lab Horn.
I didn’t know that.
> What size room will you have?
21’ * 17’ * avg 11’ (6.7 * 5.3 * avg 3.5 m)
Digging starts in two days time.
> What is the floor, walls and ceiling constructed of?
Cement floor, acoustic plasterboard (dry-wall) walls and ceiling.
Corners are also plasterboard (dry-wall), with a 12” (300 mm) gap behind a door one side, and a closet from the other side intruding on the other – not quite symmetrical.
> Where will be the midbass horns in relation to the subhorns in the room?
To be decided, hopefully with ½ lambda won’t be too hard.
> Which midbass horns will you be using?
To be built using JBL 2202Hs in a tractrix, maybe 90-120 Hz flare
> How many horns to cover 40-100 ?
Just one good one
> What amplifier, crossover to drive them?
To be decided after horns are picked. Looking for only 110 dB max, maybe just a Rotel 60 watter I have handy.
> Why not go lower?
Underneath will be sealed boxes with EQ using Peerless XLS drivers I have & 200 watt amps I have.
> A better solution may be 25-35 Hz horns used up to 60-80 Hz.
Maybe, I’d rather make the two midbass a little smaller, plus 25-35 Hz would be a bigger horn.
> What is your time, space, and construction budget?
Not set. I’ll develop the plan I like, without going overboard, and take as long as it does.
> Will you make the horn out of plywood, brick, or concrete?
Whatever’s easiest – wood I imagine.
> Do you want the horns to be permanent?
I hope to get at least a decade out of them in place.
Cheers
> the best is full size solid horns built into the room.
I was staring to lean that way.
What you could do is use three or four of them and couple them to the corners to get a much more linear output.
Ouch, budget won’t stretch above one.
> Placement is ultra critical with small horns like the Lab Horn.
I didn’t know that.
> What size room will you have?
21’ * 17’ * avg 11’ (6.7 * 5.3 * avg 3.5 m)
Digging starts in two days time.
> What is the floor, walls and ceiling constructed of?
Cement floor, acoustic plasterboard (dry-wall) walls and ceiling.
Corners are also plasterboard (dry-wall), with a 12” (300 mm) gap behind a door one side, and a closet from the other side intruding on the other – not quite symmetrical.
> Where will be the midbass horns in relation to the subhorns in the room?
To be decided, hopefully with ½ lambda won’t be too hard.
> Which midbass horns will you be using?
To be built using JBL 2202Hs in a tractrix, maybe 90-120 Hz flare
> How many horns to cover 40-100 ?
Just one good one
> What amplifier, crossover to drive them?
To be decided after horns are picked. Looking for only 110 dB max, maybe just a Rotel 60 watter I have handy.
> Why not go lower?
Underneath will be sealed boxes with EQ using Peerless XLS drivers I have & 200 watt amps I have.
> A better solution may be 25-35 Hz horns used up to 60-80 Hz.
Maybe, I’d rather make the two midbass a little smaller, plus 25-35 Hz would be a bigger horn.
> What is your time, space, and construction budget?
Not set. I’ll develop the plan I like, without going overboard, and take as long as it does.
> Will you make the horn out of plywood, brick, or concrete?
Whatever’s easiest – wood I imagine.
> Do you want the horns to be permanent?
I hope to get at least a decade out of them in place.
Cheers
rick57 said:
Hi
If you are going to make this room from scratch,
(did I misunderstand that part? )
why not put the basshorn under the floor?
Would leave more room for your midbasshorns...
cheers 😉
Hi
Yes I’m building from scratch,
> put the basshorn under the floor?
That would be great!
But to put it under the floor – extra digging, concrete work, moisture barriers, alas too many $.
So hopefully I’ll have more room in the budget for midbasshorns, nice tube amps, more CDs ...
Limited means, unlimited wants . .
Cheers
Yes I’m building from scratch,
> put the basshorn under the floor?
That would be great!
But to put it under the floor – extra digging, concrete work, moisture barriers, alas too many $.
So hopefully I’ll have more room in the budget for midbasshorns, nice tube amps, more CDs ...
Limited means, unlimited wants . .
Cheers
* There's one thing that can be factored in * now
If I go with the simple long straight bass horn, say with flare at 50 Hz firing down to a concrete floor, how far off the floor should the mouth be positioned?
Before this long horn idea emerged, the walls were going to be plasterboard (Drywall), but if I decide very soon, I can have that section of the lower wall near where the horn exits, in brick. How big a section wall might be getting the horn ‘blast’ and would benefit fro solidity?
For example, maybe the mouth should be positioned 150 mm (6 inches) = H1 off the floor.
Then the height of bricks (instead of plaster) might be H1 + say 100 mm (4 inches)??
If the horn mouth is calculated to be say 1 metre ( 39 inches) = W1.
Then the width of bricks (instead of plaster) might be W1 + say 200 mm (8 inches)?? ie 100 mm (4 inches) a side "extra"
Comments welcome
🙂
If I go with the simple long straight bass horn, say with flare at 50 Hz firing down to a concrete floor, how far off the floor should the mouth be positioned?
Before this long horn idea emerged, the walls were going to be plasterboard (Drywall), but if I decide very soon, I can have that section of the lower wall near where the horn exits, in brick. How big a section wall might be getting the horn ‘blast’ and would benefit fro solidity?
For example, maybe the mouth should be positioned 150 mm (6 inches) = H1 off the floor.
Then the height of bricks (instead of plaster) might be H1 + say 100 mm (4 inches)??
If the horn mouth is calculated to be say 1 metre ( 39 inches) = W1.
Then the width of bricks (instead of plaster) might be W1 + say 200 mm (8 inches)?? ie 100 mm (4 inches) a side "extra"
Comments welcome
🙂
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