I have opened this thread to canvas opinions on commercial postings on DIY Audio.
In the past, you the members, and us the mods, have been fairly strict on people posting to the board with a business offering.
However, many of our longstanding members do run businesses related to this hobby of ours, and what we would like to do is to help them, in return for their non commercial input, to offer relevant services to members.
One of the current ideas we are playing with, is that traders with products to sell should have their own forum. They would be allowed pre moderated posts in that area, say one a month, or one for say every 50 or so posts they make.
This is not a commercialisation of the board, it just legitimises the current situation where longstanding trade members get away with the odd post in TP, and we turn a blind eye. It will not involve pop -ups, banners, ads or any of that nonsense, and unless you go to that forum, you will not be aware of it's existence.
We will continue to prosecute spam in all its forms.
Comments?
In the past, you the members, and us the mods, have been fairly strict on people posting to the board with a business offering.
However, many of our longstanding members do run businesses related to this hobby of ours, and what we would like to do is to help them, in return for their non commercial input, to offer relevant services to members.
One of the current ideas we are playing with, is that traders with products to sell should have their own forum. They would be allowed pre moderated posts in that area, say one a month, or one for say every 50 or so posts they make.
This is not a commercialisation of the board, it just legitimises the current situation where longstanding trade members get away with the odd post in TP, and we turn a blind eye. It will not involve pop -ups, banners, ads or any of that nonsense, and unless you go to that forum, you will not be aware of it's existence.
We will continue to prosecute spam in all its forms.
Comments?
I don't mind at all seeing business offerings by forum members. I think everyone here that has a business is very polite about the manner in which they advertise, and if there is a way to make their products more accessible then that is great. I think many forumites might be looking for something and not even realize that, say, Steve @ ApexJr stocks it.
I don't see any reason to limit the number of posts if they will all be moderator-approved anyway. I don't think tying anything to #/posts is a good idea!
I don't think this new forum should preclude someone quietly mentioning their wares in the correct context though. I guess I am against adding more levels of control to the board; I don't think we have a problem with spam currently, so why do we need more spam controls? If the suggestion is more to provide another, more structured area in which to advertise, though, I am all for it.
I don't see any reason to limit the number of posts if they will all be moderator-approved anyway. I don't think tying anything to #/posts is a good idea!
I don't think this new forum should preclude someone quietly mentioning their wares in the correct context though. I guess I am against adding more levels of control to the board; I don't think we have a problem with spam currently, so why do we need more spam controls? If the suggestion is more to provide another, more structured area in which to advertise, though, I am all for it.
The DIYAudio-Mart
I would like to see a separate section created for businesses to post offering in the same thread and post manner as the main forum. This will allow any business to offer their products or services and give them incentive to participate if they want the thread/offering to stay current. The uninvolved will quickly have their thread buried into oblivion while rewarding the participator with extended “air-time”. I feel it should be separate so the DIY atmosphere is maintained on the main forum and actual DIY threads are not buried by business deals.
It may even be a way to eventually finance to forum, but that’s another issue.
Rodd Yamashita
I would like to see a separate section created for businesses to post offering in the same thread and post manner as the main forum. This will allow any business to offer their products or services and give them incentive to participate if they want the thread/offering to stay current. The uninvolved will quickly have their thread buried into oblivion while rewarding the participator with extended “air-time”. I feel it should be separate so the DIY atmosphere is maintained on the main forum and actual DIY threads are not buried by business deals.
It may even be a way to eventually finance to forum, but that’s another issue.
Rodd Yamashita
commerce
Personally I think nobody should have the right to veto commercial offerings, PROVIDED that they are in a separate thread. The beauty of this forum is that you can select threads of interest. If I am interested in commercial offerings, I can go to that thread. But please spare us the regular hobby threads interspersed with commercial blabla!
And as long as it is a separate thread there should not be a need for a close moderation. You guys would only get yourself a lot more work, with no advantage I can see. Do you moderators really want to get involved in disputes of the type " hey I send this guy money and I didn't get diddly, please throw him of the board"? Commercial = commercial != moderation IMO.
Jan Didden
Personally I think nobody should have the right to veto commercial offerings, PROVIDED that they are in a separate thread. The beauty of this forum is that you can select threads of interest. If I am interested in commercial offerings, I can go to that thread. But please spare us the regular hobby threads interspersed with commercial blabla!
And as long as it is a separate thread there should not be a need for a close moderation. You guys would only get yourself a lot more work, with no advantage I can see. Do you moderators really want to get involved in disputes of the type " hey I send this guy money and I didn't get diddly, please throw him of the board"? Commercial = commercial != moderation IMO.
Jan Didden
Hi,
I think the DIYaudio should consider collecting revenue from commercial posts.
If people want to profit, they should invest.
Of course defining "commercial" would then become an issue.
Commercial offerings must be kept separate.
Cheers,
I think the DIYaudio should consider collecting revenue from commercial posts.
If people want to profit, they should invest.
Of course defining "commercial" would then become an issue.
Commercial offerings must be kept separate.
Cheers,
Supporting Rodd
I agree with Rodd. A separate forum for commercial offerings. Trading post could be more for the small DIY/random project surplus, whereas the DIYMart would be commercial. It might not hurt to allow some sort of feedback via posts in there as well. I'm sure if anybody gets cheated, though, that would make its way to light whether or not there were feedback.
As you mentioned at the end of the post, though. . . no spam, pop-ups or other internet decaying.
S.
I agree with Rodd. A separate forum for commercial offerings. Trading post could be more for the small DIY/random project surplus, whereas the DIYMart would be commercial. It might not hurt to allow some sort of feedback via posts in there as well. I'm sure if anybody gets cheated, though, that would make its way to light whether or not there were feedback.
As you mentioned at the end of the post, though. . . no spam, pop-ups or other internet decaying.
S.
If someone want to mention a solution or part they sell to somebody in a thread they can post the link to the DIYMart (like that name BTW) without elaborating to much.
I would be fine with a new forum area under DIY, just like for Loudspeakers, solid-state, etc. However, I would not want posts to show up on the main page as there would be the tendency to overpost so that your post is always in the 20 newest. It should be "invisible" so to speak unless someone specifically goes to that part of the DIY Forums. I would not limit the number of posts by anyone.
I would not charge. If you don't charge, then you can keep a lot better control. When you combine site moderation and charging, you are looking at a potential law suit at some point.
Alvaius
I would not charge. If you don't charge, then you can keep a lot better control. When you combine site moderation and charging, you are looking at a potential law suit at some point.
Alvaius
PM what about bulk purchases? Are they considered commercial?It would be nice to have a section for that. It would give more exposure to threads and make them more effective. Maybe combine that with some type of wiki section built in so that people could sign up on the spot.
As far as trading post advertisements I don't know set it up and see how it works out. Vendors and manifacturers get already exposure by posting here and having a link to their website in the signature and elsewhere. If people are interested in their products they can check out the website out.
As far as trading post advertisements I don't know set it up and see how it works out. Vendors and manifacturers get already exposure by posting here and having a link to their website in the signature and elsewhere. If people are interested in their products they can check out the website out.
$$.
Hi,
Good idea Rodd.
Let's just hope they play it fair...maybe they could be prevented from posting outside their own commercial area in order not to influence others?
Cheers, 😉
Hi,
Good idea Rodd.
Let's just hope they play it fair...maybe they could be prevented from posting outside their own commercial area in order not to influence others?
Cheers, 😉
People that have businesses related to audio SHOULD state that in their sig line, so the comments can be judged on their merit in the spirit of disclosure. If that person has a special on a product that would relate to a topic under discussion in an audio thread, then they could link to the details of that posted in a seperate DIYMart. That was if someone isn't interested they don't have to look, those that are can, and it looks as little like spam as possible. For example, at the end of a post, a line like "I have several of these transformers on DIYMart {link}"
Please be aware that there are a lot of people who'll take advantage of it. For example there is a famous reviewer that now works for a large audio company who <b>only</b> pops up to hawk his product. These sorts of posts should be deleted on sight, as well as people who register simply to post pseudo-ads into threads, or start their own. A number of people register with Yahoo groups for example and spam the list, and it would be a pity if that happenned here. As a matter of principle, my preference would be for these sorts of posts to be deleted (if obvious spam) or moved to Texas (if questionable) to maintain the spirit of an amateur and enthusiast forum. There are already a number of people who let us know what they do in a great way, and don't push their products. Hugh Dean is an example.
Please be aware that there are a lot of people who'll take advantage of it. For example there is a famous reviewer that now works for a large audio company who <b>only</b> pops up to hawk his product. These sorts of posts should be deleted on sight, as well as people who register simply to post pseudo-ads into threads, or start their own. A number of people register with Yahoo groups for example and spam the list, and it would be a pity if that happenned here. As a matter of principle, my preference would be for these sorts of posts to be deleted (if obvious spam) or moved to Texas (if questionable) to maintain the spirit of an amateur and enthusiast forum. There are already a number of people who let us know what they do in a great way, and don't push their products. Hugh Dean is an example.
VESTED INTERESTS.
Hi,
Oh,yes...Hugh is a good example and there are others.
Take Jonathan Carr, Joe Curcio and so on....in fact there is hardly anyone you could accuse of pushing their product, amazing really.
Hats off to you all, gentlemen...
Still the risk is very much there which is why I suggested the limitations on the profile of the companies not necessarily their CEO's.
I don't have a % at hand but I don't think I'm too far off the mark if I say that at least 10% of the members have an audio related business?
Maybe some rules of conduct for paying members/businesses should be written up if deemed necessary?
Cheers,😉
Hi,
Oh,yes...Hugh is a good example and there are others.
Take Jonathan Carr, Joe Curcio and so on....in fact there is hardly anyone you could accuse of pushing their product, amazing really.
Hats off to you all, gentlemen...
Still the risk is very much there which is why I suggested the limitations on the profile of the companies not necessarily their CEO's.
I don't have a % at hand but I don't think I'm too far off the mark if I say that at least 10% of the members have an audio related business?
Maybe some rules of conduct for paying members/businesses should be written up if deemed necessary?
Cheers,😉
Re: VESTED INTERESTS.
Frank, I think you are very wrong here. My guess is that 10-20 people has some business above hobby level, not 500!
Anyway, I think the basic idea is good.
fdegrove said:
Frank, I think you are very wrong here. My guess is that 10-20 people has some business above hobby level, not 500!
Anyway, I think the basic idea is good.
Commercial Postings on DiyAudio
Hi,
I like the idea. I think it would help new members that want to build an amp if they could go to that forum and find suppliers of the parts they need.
Bob2
Hi,
I like the idea. I think it would help new members that want to build an amp if they could go to that forum and find suppliers of the parts they need.
Bob2
Commercial Posting
This is a great forum. Please don't allow it to be cluttered with commercials. I agree with Rodd.
This is a great forum. Please don't allow it to be cluttered with commercials. I agree with Rodd.
Money makes the world go round
Keep it that way please. Thank God this site is like it is. There is enough commercialisation in the world. Everything is about money and a hobby site should be about a hobby, not money and offerings. It is called www.DIYaudio.com you know.
That longstanding members have businesses related to this hobby is fine and good for them. They will probably also learn from this forum themselves, nobody knows ALL about his/hers occupation. They were also hobbyists once and understand what most of us experience: sometimes you just lack the knowledge or experience to do something. So you need help from people who know and are able to explain this particular problem. This site is a means for this.
But this can not be an excuse for commercial input !
If they like to sniff some of the atmosphere of their pre-business occupation, they can visit this site. They can exchange information with other members that have businesses per private email. This site is also a meeting point with other designers whoms email-adresses they otherwise wouldn't know. If they want to sell things they have to be on their own.
Their non-commercial input is very welcome but why do they need any help on a commercial level from us ??? Sounds pretty pathetic to me. Why should help be rewarded with money or commercial interests???
That members have also experienced a time that they needed help and they probably got it for free as well from friends with more experience...
Keep it that way please. Thank God this site is like it is. There is enough commercialisation in the world. Everything is about money and a hobby site should be about a hobby, not money and offerings. It is called www.DIYaudio.com you know.
That longstanding members have businesses related to this hobby is fine and good for them. They will probably also learn from this forum themselves, nobody knows ALL about his/hers occupation. They were also hobbyists once and understand what most of us experience: sometimes you just lack the knowledge or experience to do something. So you need help from people who know and are able to explain this particular problem. This site is a means for this.
But this can not be an excuse for commercial input !
If they like to sniff some of the atmosphere of their pre-business occupation, they can visit this site. They can exchange information with other members that have businesses per private email. This site is also a meeting point with other designers whoms email-adresses they otherwise wouldn't know. If they want to sell things they have to be on their own.
Their non-commercial input is very welcome but why do they need any help on a commercial level from us ??? Sounds pretty pathetic to me. Why should help be rewarded with money or commercial interests???
That members have also experienced a time that they needed help and they probably got it for free as well from friends with more experience...
FREE FORUM.
Hi,
J-P and others: the idea is not to go commercial with the forum but to allow Jason to pay the bills by allowing as little as need be so the forum can survive...
You guys all get your 10.000 Euro servers,routers,disks and what have you for free of course.
Given a choice, wouldn't you be prepared to to accept a little concession or would you rather see the forum disappear?
Cheers,😉
Hi,
J-P and others: the idea is not to go commercial with the forum but to allow Jason to pay the bills by allowing as little as need be so the forum can survive...
You guys all get your 10.000 Euro servers,routers,disks and what have you for free of course.
Given a choice, wouldn't you be prepared to to accept a little concession or would you rather see the forum disappear?
Cheers,😉
Frank, JP,
Even at that, it wasn’t the main intension of my suggestion to pay for the operation of the forum, but only as a possible benefit. The real benefit/feature of my suggestion would be to have a commercial forum unlike anything else on the web that I’ve seen.
It would encourage manufactures and dealers to present their wares but force them to defend/support the product at the same time. How often have you been presented, as a consumer, with the opportunity to discuss the virtues or shortcomings of a product directly with the maker. In this forum, if the manufacturer does not reply, the discussion of his product goes by the wayside, as does his advertisement. It will take a special kind of manufacturer or dealer to stand behind a product on this type of forum. The kind that I wouldn’t mind dealing with.
It has to be separate from the main forum. Independent in a way that you could continue on the main forum as we are today without influence from the “commercial” forum. The commercial forum would have its own “current thread list”. All advertisement would be limited to starting a thread to present your product or service. Although any member should be free to start a thread about a commercial product. Such threads will last as long as they draw the interest.🙂
Rodd Yamashita
Even at that, it wasn’t the main intension of my suggestion to pay for the operation of the forum, but only as a possible benefit. The real benefit/feature of my suggestion would be to have a commercial forum unlike anything else on the web that I’ve seen.
It would encourage manufactures and dealers to present their wares but force them to defend/support the product at the same time. How often have you been presented, as a consumer, with the opportunity to discuss the virtues or shortcomings of a product directly with the maker. In this forum, if the manufacturer does not reply, the discussion of his product goes by the wayside, as does his advertisement. It will take a special kind of manufacturer or dealer to stand behind a product on this type of forum. The kind that I wouldn’t mind dealing with.
It has to be separate from the main forum. Independent in a way that you could continue on the main forum as we are today without influence from the “commercial” forum. The commercial forum would have its own “current thread list”. All advertisement would be limited to starting a thread to present your product or service. Although any member should be free to start a thread about a commercial product. Such threads will last as long as they draw the interest.🙂
Rodd Yamashita
KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN.
Hi Rodd,
I fully understand what you mean and if we could attract manufactures like this that would be great indeed.
Some have their online forum already and I feel it is a good way to boost a product.
In essence it amounts to having an online helpdesk...in which case the cost of hosting that forum could keep "the forum" afloat too.
Cheers,😉
Hi Rodd,
I fully understand what you mean and if we could attract manufactures like this that would be great indeed.
Some have their online forum already and I feel it is a good way to boost a product.
In essence it amounts to having an online helpdesk...in which case the cost of hosting that forum could keep "the forum" afloat too.
Cheers,😉
- Status
- Not open for further replies.