Only one tiny mention of a full line array......
Mod Note: This thread was split off from here
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=100195
dave
______________________________
Once I experienced a line array system, I never had any interest at all in going back to MINIATURE MUSIC. Now some people have been brought up on miniature music and don't want to hear full sound in their house, but I do.
Prior to building my line array(took me two 1/2 years including the learning curve), there were certain kinds of music which I could never listen to and in any way confuse it with the real thing: top of the list was piano and organ.
Since my line array is finished, I could swear there was a fella playing a grand piano 10 feet from me, or that I was actually in a church listening to a full pipe organ.
The heck with middle speakers, and back speakers, my full three way line array puts me inside the near field without reflections, and all the ambience, and reality is right in my face as if I was really at the performance. The ONLY thing less real is that my front wall is only 12 feet wide so a symphony orchestra with a 35 foot front is shorter. Last night I was listening to Michael Murray playing Toccata & Fugue in D minor(organ), and after 6 months of listening I could still say an unequivocal, "WOW!" at the end.
Go for full size music, not MINIATURE MUSIC.
Email me if you want a full description of my system, and how much it cost( less than $1600, including electronic crossovers, and Tri-Amping)
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
Mod Note: This thread was split off from here
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=100195
dave
______________________________
Once I experienced a line array system, I never had any interest at all in going back to MINIATURE MUSIC. Now some people have been brought up on miniature music and don't want to hear full sound in their house, but I do.
Prior to building my line array(took me two 1/2 years including the learning curve), there were certain kinds of music which I could never listen to and in any way confuse it with the real thing: top of the list was piano and organ.
Since my line array is finished, I could swear there was a fella playing a grand piano 10 feet from me, or that I was actually in a church listening to a full pipe organ.
The heck with middle speakers, and back speakers, my full three way line array puts me inside the near field without reflections, and all the ambience, and reality is right in my face as if I was really at the performance. The ONLY thing less real is that my front wall is only 12 feet wide so a symphony orchestra with a 35 foot front is shorter. Last night I was listening to Michael Murray playing Toccata & Fugue in D minor(organ), and after 6 months of listening I could still say an unequivocal, "WOW!" at the end.
Go for full size music, not MINIATURE MUSIC.
Email me if you want a full description of my system, and how much it cost( less than $1600, including electronic crossovers, and Tri-Amping)
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
Could anyone comment on what :Zarathu
has just brought in ( line arrays )
i have build serveral line array systems ..all stereo
and all compromises for $$$ and efficiency
though i loved the powerfull mids of all 3-4" drivers,
i cannot say that they do define soundstage more in my room where i have tested em, then my cheapo stereo 3 way enclosures ...
What exactly do line array alter in term of source localisation ... ??
On another subject; the drivers i will use will need to have a pretty good dispertion and off axis performance if i want 6 by 2 people size to listen and all get the same performance...how do we get those numbers?
is there a minimum to look at?
i can easily check out by hand or in 3d depending on driver distance how much angle will be required at almost full spl ...
do all the drivers have some minimum angle from 0degree before they start going down ?
( i mean is there always a 5 or 10 or 15 degree where we get all the spl before the off axis response starts to go down ? )
has just brought in ( line arrays )
i have build serveral line array systems ..all stereo
and all compromises for $$$ and efficiency
though i loved the powerfull mids of all 3-4" drivers,
i cannot say that they do define soundstage more in my room where i have tested em, then my cheapo stereo 3 way enclosures ...
What exactly do line array alter in term of source localisation ... ??
On another subject; the drivers i will use will need to have a pretty good dispertion and off axis performance if i want 6 by 2 people size to listen and all get the same performance...how do we get those numbers?
is there a minimum to look at?
i can easily check out by hand or in 3d depending on driver distance how much angle will be required at almost full spl ...
do all the drivers have some minimum angle from 0degree before they start going down ?
( i mean is there always a 5 or 10 or 15 degree where we get all the spl before the off axis response starts to go down ? )
You have to remember that my arrays are also operating with electronic crossovers, and a separate amp for each line. The two woofers have a 350 w/ch amp, the midrange line has a 175 w/ch amp, and the tweeter lines have a 60 w/ch amp.
Amplifier power comes to 1120 RMS watts total. The woofer SPL is 92, the Midrange spl is 96, and the tweeter spl is 106.
The crossover is a Rane AC23 with time delay. There is no passive crossover padding. Balance is handled by the power amps and the Rane crossover amplification circuits.
I doubt whether the system would sound nearly the same if it wasn't tri-amped.
However, having lived for many years(I'm 58 years old) with very high quality DIY point source systems, I'll never go back to them.
To each his own.
If you find that cheapo three way speakers provide more detail and less distortion than my 60 tweeters, 34 mid ranges and woofers that only handle 165hz and down electronically crossed and Tri-amp powered by 1100 watts rms........ more power to you.
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
Amplifier power comes to 1120 RMS watts total. The woofer SPL is 92, the Midrange spl is 96, and the tweeter spl is 106.
The crossover is a Rane AC23 with time delay. There is no passive crossover padding. Balance is handled by the power amps and the Rane crossover amplification circuits.
I doubt whether the system would sound nearly the same if it wasn't tri-amped.
However, having lived for many years(I'm 58 years old) with very high quality DIY point source systems, I'll never go back to them.
To each his own.
If you find that cheapo three way speakers provide more detail and less distortion than my 60 tweeters, 34 mid ranges and woofers that only handle 165hz and down electronically crossed and Tri-amp powered by 1100 watts rms........ more power to you.
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
Also.....
Each of my 3 inch 3.3 Xmax mid ranges(crossed at 165, and at 2650) are in their own completely separate enclosure, separated by 3/4 inch air space from the others.
They are in 23.5 x 4 inch PVC tubes. The tubes are sealed, and are stuffed with 4lb/cu. ft. fiberglass stuffing, with pillow fill coverings on one end to protect the speakers from fiberglass fibers. This enclosure makes an enormous difference in the quality of the midrange speakers, and virtually eliminates the sound back to through the speaker, and the qualities of a tube itself eliminated odd ordered harmonics, meaning what is left is the even ones which introduce what's left as clarity in sound(inside the cabinets).
Tubes get stronger when pressure is put into them.
The 15 Xmax Goldsound woofers handle the sound from 165hz down. They have an F3 of 31.5 hz.
ITS NOT YOUR USUAL LINE ARRAY DESIGN........
Zarathu
Each of my 3 inch 3.3 Xmax mid ranges(crossed at 165, and at 2650) are in their own completely separate enclosure, separated by 3/4 inch air space from the others.
They are in 23.5 x 4 inch PVC tubes. The tubes are sealed, and are stuffed with 4lb/cu. ft. fiberglass stuffing, with pillow fill coverings on one end to protect the speakers from fiberglass fibers. This enclosure makes an enormous difference in the quality of the midrange speakers, and virtually eliminates the sound back to through the speaker, and the qualities of a tube itself eliminated odd ordered harmonics, meaning what is left is the even ones which introduce what's left as clarity in sound(inside the cabinets).
Tubes get stronger when pressure is put into them.
The 15 Xmax Goldsound woofers handle the sound from 165hz down. They have an F3 of 31.5 hz.
ITS NOT YOUR USUAL LINE ARRAY DESIGN........
Zarathu
one more thing..... : JAMES GRIFFIN, PHD
Anyone who has built line arrays and has not done so using the research provided by Jim Griffin, PhD, in his reaserach on line arrays
http://www.audiodiycentral.com/awpapers.shtml
has undoubtedly built ones which will not sustain the test of time. Nearfield line arrays for use in small rooms are a far cry from those used in auditoriums, and the work of Dr.Griffin has done that same for line array systems that the work of Thiele and Small did for taking vented and sealed mid and bass speaker systems out of the voodoo land.
If you didn't build your line arrays using the Griffin parameters, then you cannot compare them to mine. it would be like comparing a speaker designed by the seat of your pants to one design using T/S data and computers.
Zarathu
Anyone who has built line arrays and has not done so using the research provided by Jim Griffin, PhD, in his reaserach on line arrays
http://www.audiodiycentral.com/awpapers.shtml
has undoubtedly built ones which will not sustain the test of time. Nearfield line arrays for use in small rooms are a far cry from those used in auditoriums, and the work of Dr.Griffin has done that same for line array systems that the work of Thiele and Small did for taking vented and sealed mid and bass speaker systems out of the voodoo land.
If you didn't build your line arrays using the Griffin parameters, then you cannot compare them to mine. it would be like comparing a speaker designed by the seat of your pants to one design using T/S data and computers.
Zarathu
Zarathu said:
I have little doubt that the arrays sound better with active XOs, but i doubt i could live with your amps* and i certainly couldn't live with the Rane XO...
*over the last 5 years or so it has become fairly clear that there is a general correlation between power & how good an amp can sound (at least within my experience & to my ears) with the better amps all being smaller. Around here a big amp is 50W and the best ones are 2-10W.
dave
I need a little more to understand you, Dave......
OK....
Dave,
You said....
"over the last 5 years or so it has become fairly clear that there is a general correlation between power & how good an amp can sound (at least within my experience & to my ears) with the better amps all being smaller."
Fairly clear to who? This isn't obvious to me. So could you provide the references to substantiate your "it have become fairly clear". Now perhaps I'm too far out of the mainstream, but I've heard nothing that says this. You also said, " at least within my experience & to my ears." So which is it, something you believe or something some part of the audio community believes?
Also, could you show the speaker system you have the picture without the covers over the speakers, so that the speakers are visible? Or failing that, could you share some of the design parameters for it? Is that a woofer system next to it? What is its configuration? Is this an example of a line array that you can't live with?
And, you said the arrays "could have been designed by Jim". Did you mean Jim Griffin? Who were they designed by, and could you give us some design parameters of those arrays? I have seen many designs that claimed they were following Jim's paper and it appeared that the person never read it at all.
You've spoken in a lot of generalities to disagree with my point of view on line arrays.
It may be that your real point of view is just represented by "I just don't like line array sound." And that's clearly, then, your opinion.
I've been very specific in what my system consists of and how its built. I can't very appreciate your point of reference unless you are willing to provide the same level of specificity---unless its just a personal, non-specific dislike of the line arrays you have heard, and you can't really explain what you don't like.
Kind regards,
Zarathu
OK....
Dave,
You said....
"over the last 5 years or so it has become fairly clear that there is a general correlation between power & how good an amp can sound (at least within my experience & to my ears) with the better amps all being smaller."
Fairly clear to who? This isn't obvious to me. So could you provide the references to substantiate your "it have become fairly clear". Now perhaps I'm too far out of the mainstream, but I've heard nothing that says this. You also said, " at least within my experience & to my ears." So which is it, something you believe or something some part of the audio community believes?
Also, could you show the speaker system you have the picture without the covers over the speakers, so that the speakers are visible? Or failing that, could you share some of the design parameters for it? Is that a woofer system next to it? What is its configuration? Is this an example of a line array that you can't live with?
And, you said the arrays "could have been designed by Jim". Did you mean Jim Griffin? Who were they designed by, and could you give us some design parameters of those arrays? I have seen many designs that claimed they were following Jim's paper and it appeared that the person never read it at all.
You've spoken in a lot of generalities to disagree with my point of view on line arrays.
It may be that your real point of view is just represented by "I just don't like line array sound." And that's clearly, then, your opinion.
I've been very specific in what my system consists of and how its built. I can't very appreciate your point of reference unless you are willing to provide the same level of specificity---unless its just a personal, non-specific dislike of the line arrays you have heard, and you can't really explain what you don't like.
Kind regards,
Zarathu
Re: I need a little more to understand you, Dave......
It is something i have personally discovered over the last 30 years and it seems to be a fairly substantial part of growing part of the diy community (a very striking for instance, is that Nelson Pass (as i understand) thinks his 1st watt amps are sonically more pleasing than his big, money making Pass amps)
There are no covers on those speakers... you are looking at the raw drivers (2 4ft tall ESL panels)
Yes, Jim Griffin, and i am pretty sure they were designed by him... these were arrarys of 3 different magnitudes all with CSS WR125s + Aurun Cantus ribbons,
I have been facinated with line arrays since i was a kid (35 years!). I think what i said was pretty clear... i have yet to hear a line array i could live with. Of course that is my personal opinion.
Well not really... we don't know anything about your amps (except that they are high powered which sets them at a disadvantage, and nothing about the drivers you used, just the quantity -- and in light of just the quantity, the quality would be suspect.
I don't dispute that you have a system that you thorougly enjoy, i'm just saying that given my experience, and the limited description you have provided, that i probably couldn't.
The best LA i've heard were the ones from the pic i posted
http://www.t-linespeakers.org/FALL/system/index.html
they gave way to a system that i found much more musically enjoyable, and i have improved on that original replacement system considerably
Jin is going to have to weigh the descriptions of the experiences of others, make his own choices (& misteps) and take his own path to audio nirvana.
It is most important that he get the room right, and leave things flexible, since there is a very good chance, no matter what he chooses, he won't get it right the 1st time (or more accurately, learn so much from the 1st crack, that a 2nd crack will produce something better)
dave
Zarathu said:
It is something i have personally discovered over the last 30 years and it seems to be a fairly substantial part of growing part of the diy community (a very striking for instance, is that Nelson Pass (as i understand) thinks his 1st watt amps are sonically more pleasing than his big, money making Pass amps)
There are no covers on those speakers... you are looking at the raw drivers (2 4ft tall ESL panels)
Yes, Jim Griffin, and i am pretty sure they were designed by him... these were arrarys of 3 different magnitudes all with CSS WR125s + Aurun Cantus ribbons,
I have been facinated with line arrays since i was a kid (35 years!). I think what i said was pretty clear... i have yet to hear a line array i could live with. Of course that is my personal opinion.
Well not really... we don't know anything about your amps (except that they are high powered which sets them at a disadvantage, and nothing about the drivers you used, just the quantity -- and in light of just the quantity, the quality would be suspect.
I don't dispute that you have a system that you thorougly enjoy, i'm just saying that given my experience, and the limited description you have provided, that i probably couldn't.
The best LA i've heard were the ones from the pic i posted
http://www.t-linespeakers.org/FALL/system/index.html
they gave way to a system that i found much more musically enjoyable, and i have improved on that original replacement system considerably
Jin is going to have to weigh the descriptions of the experiences of others, make his own choices (& misteps) and take his own path to audio nirvana.
It is most important that he get the room right, and leave things flexible, since there is a very good chance, no matter what he chooses, he won't get it right the 1st time (or more accurately, learn so much from the 1st crack, that a 2nd crack will produce something better)
dave
Bonzai Apples VS Watermelons
DAVE,
Been to your TL website and the Frugal horn website. Actually been there many times and used it when I thought a TL would work for me, but I didn't know it was yours.
Looking at what you consider to be the best in the world shows me that we don't exist in the same world. You're talking about apples(McIntoshes, actually, pun intended as I type this on my Powerbook 800), and I'm talking about watermelons.
Your apples are indeed tasty. However someone who was brought up on watermelons would find apples to be unfilling and just not near as sweet as a good watermelon.
There is no way that we even have much common ground, since you even prefer bonzai apples, less than a bite's worth.
But here in this discussion, I hope everyone knows that your taste is in apples..... ;-)
Mine is in watermelons, with a few cantalopes thrown in. I am a VEgan after all. If it doesn't grow out of the ground, I don't eat it.
Zarathu
DAVE,
Been to your TL website and the Frugal horn website. Actually been there many times and used it when I thought a TL would work for me, but I didn't know it was yours.
Looking at what you consider to be the best in the world shows me that we don't exist in the same world. You're talking about apples(McIntoshes, actually, pun intended as I type this on my Powerbook 800), and I'm talking about watermelons.
Your apples are indeed tasty. However someone who was brought up on watermelons would find apples to be unfilling and just not near as sweet as a good watermelon.
There is no way that we even have much common ground, since you even prefer bonzai apples, less than a bite's worth.
But here in this discussion, I hope everyone knows that your taste is in apples..... ;-)
Mine is in watermelons, with a few cantalopes thrown in. I am a VEgan after all. If it doesn't grow out of the ground, I don't eat it.
Zarathu
PS...sorry to disagree....
Your posted example from your website is a set of electrostatics, but ES's are not line arrays.
I know they are in a line sort of, but we discussed the difference between a real line array(which consists of multiple dynamic speakers in a line with certain C-to-C distances, and appropriate crossover patterns) and an electrostatic, on the Audio round table line array forum, and they have none of the characteristics of a line array other than being tall.
If I misunderstood you, and you were showing your ES's as NOT an example of a line array but as something that you liked, I apologize for my soap box.
Zarathu
Your posted example from your website is a set of electrostatics, but ES's are not line arrays.
I know they are in a line sort of, but we discussed the difference between a real line array(which consists of multiple dynamic speakers in a line with certain C-to-C distances, and appropriate crossover patterns) and an electrostatic, on the Audio round table line array forum, and they have none of the characteristics of a line array other than being tall.
If I misunderstood you, and you were showing your ES's as NOT an example of a line array but as something that you liked, I apologize for my soap box.
Zarathu
Re: PS...sorry to disagree....
They are line arrays... just not using dynamic drivers... in a dynamic line array the best tweeters are considered to be planar, and the longer the planar the less gap dicontinuity, so from that point of view the 45" newform or 75" BG or some of the new long true ribbons make the best ribbon lines... the tall skinny ESL panels are just a logical extension of that... i suspect that the ESLs LAs could be improved by the additon of a long ribbon (and at one point i schemed about a pair of newform R45s to mate with them).
As i said i have been facinated by line arrays for some 35 years... the real line array -- the ideal -- is one long continuaous panel where C-C effectivelu goes to zero, so the ESl qualifies there. Line Arrays made with discreet drivers are an approximation of the ideal (and are typically more accessable to the diyer to build. What you are talking about is not line arrays in general, but line array made specifically with "point source" dynamic drivers,
The ESLs were the only line array i've been able to live with, with the challenge of finding a sufficiently good, sufficiently large amplifier to drive them and the haze introduced by the XO (which i'd suspect is a notch higher quality than your Rane) finally sealing their fate (SY now has them, refurbed and improved, with a purpose built direct drive tube amp -- i could probably live with that)
I'm still facinated by arrarys, and i still play with the idea of building one, but when i consider what else i could play with for the cost of enuff decent drivers, the project gets pushed to the very low priority
dave
Zarathu said:
They are line arrays... just not using dynamic drivers... in a dynamic line array the best tweeters are considered to be planar, and the longer the planar the less gap dicontinuity, so from that point of view the 45" newform or 75" BG or some of the new long true ribbons make the best ribbon lines... the tall skinny ESL panels are just a logical extension of that... i suspect that the ESLs LAs could be improved by the additon of a long ribbon (and at one point i schemed about a pair of newform R45s to mate with them).
As i said i have been facinated by line arrays for some 35 years... the real line array -- the ideal -- is one long continuaous panel where C-C effectivelu goes to zero, so the ESl qualifies there. Line Arrays made with discreet drivers are an approximation of the ideal (and are typically more accessable to the diyer to build. What you are talking about is not line arrays in general, but line array made specifically with "point source" dynamic drivers,
The ESLs were the only line array i've been able to live with, with the challenge of finding a sufficiently good, sufficiently large amplifier to drive them and the haze introduced by the XO (which i'd suspect is a notch higher quality than your Rane) finally sealing their fate (SY now has them, refurbed and improved, with a purpose built direct drive tube amp -- i could probably live with that)
I'm still facinated by arrarys, and i still play with the idea of building one, but when i consider what else i could play with for the cost of enuff decent drivers, the project gets pushed to the very low priority
dave
Zarathu not all of us love line arrays, The ones that I have heard do not create a very real or natural sound, the sound tends to be defused by multipoint distortion to me. Personally your use of PVC piping interests me a great deal, I have found interesting results every time I have tried it. I too personlly like the sound of the midrange of a good 3" driver.
Now I'm a bit confused, who brought up miniture speakers? I was under the impression we were discussing the Ultimate Home Theater, I've suggested 15" duel concentrics, that at 99db@1w1m, which could probably run off a 2 watt amp, others have suggested 4x 18" woofers for sub bass. Apart from my suggestion of lots of 4" fullranges for the surrounds (because of the quality of the midrange ) I cannot see any references to miniture speakers it all looks pretty big to me.
Now I'm a bit confused, who brought up miniture speakers? I was under the impression we were discussing the Ultimate Home Theater, I've suggested 15" duel concentrics, that at 99db@1w1m, which could probably run off a 2 watt amp, others have suggested 4x 18" woofers for sub bass. Apart from my suggestion of lots of 4" fullranges for the surrounds (because of the quality of the midrange ) I cannot see any references to miniture speakers it all looks pretty big to me.
Jin,
Email me privately if you wanna talk about line arrays. I'm pretty dense, but I finally get the idea that line arrays are not very well accepted here on DIY Audio.
I'll tell you anything you want to know.
I just got done listening to two very diverse musical forms, which were done as excellently with my system: Little Feat's WAITING FOR COLUMBUS at nearly full concert volume, and a series of Chopin masurkas and waltz's. Back to back, just as great with each. Forget about my 3 incher's NOT being able to produce full rock concert volume with no distortion, and huge dymanic range.
If you want to learn a lot about line arrays go to:
http://www.audioroundtable.com/ArraySpeakers/
I don't believe this is the place for it. People here don't like them.
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
Email me privately if you wanna talk about line arrays. I'm pretty dense, but I finally get the idea that line arrays are not very well accepted here on DIY Audio.
I'll tell you anything you want to know.
I just got done listening to two very diverse musical forms, which were done as excellently with my system: Little Feat's WAITING FOR COLUMBUS at nearly full concert volume, and a series of Chopin masurkas and waltz's. Back to back, just as great with each. Forget about my 3 incher's NOT being able to produce full rock concert volume with no distortion, and huge dymanic range.
If you want to learn a lot about line arrays go to:
http://www.audioroundtable.com/ArraySpeakers/
I don't believe this is the place for it. People here don't like them.
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
Zarathu said:
I don't think that is the case... do a search, you'll find lots of talk about LA, and lots of people happy with them... every speaker is a compromise, it all comes down to the set of compromises you can best live with. Line Arrays are just another approach, they certainly aren't the be all, end all..
dave
I wouldnt say that line arrays arnt well accepted in diy audio, I personally havent heard a system that I love, but I have heard some that I liked and respect, I certainly havent heard yours! therefore I could be missing out. So please keep putting your views forward.
Diapole is not a first choice for home theatre only because it is not directional, if your first love is music, go for them, but use a lot less dampening material at the sound stage.
If you want dynamic range and minimal time allignment issues, um the altecs duel concentrics are considered classics. The main aspect to these is how easy it is to get right and installed. ie Highest quality return without needing a university degree or one and a half years of refining the design to your tastes.
yes you should aim for non parrallel walls, you will not regret it
Diapole is not a first choice for home theatre only because it is not directional, if your first love is music, go for them, but use a lot less dampening material at the sound stage.
If you want dynamic range and minimal time allignment issues, um the altecs duel concentrics are considered classics. The main aspect to these is how easy it is to get right and installed. ie Highest quality return without needing a university degree or one and a half years of refining the design to your tastes.
yes you should aim for non parrallel walls, you will not regret it
Actually, I have run such searches on numerous occasions. There is an extremely small amount of discussion on them on DIY Audio, considering the amount of total discussion.
What there is, is rather unknowedgable about their design requirements, and benefits.
I stand by my suggestion to go to: http://www.audioroundtable.com/ArraySpeakers/
or to have people contact me personally. Anyone wanting to discuss real LA's would do better there. Line arrays are very different than regular DIY audio. They do have rules to prevent comb filter distortion, about the speaker placement, about the power required, etc. You can't just slap a few speakers together. And they take a huge amount of time to build. And finally, unlike point source audio, the sum of the parts are often much greater than a simple addition of the parts.
And so it goes. But I have to move on now. Good Luck Jin in your search. Hope to hear from you privately.
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
What there is, is rather unknowedgable about their design requirements, and benefits.
I stand by my suggestion to go to: http://www.audioroundtable.com/ArraySpeakers/
or to have people contact me personally. Anyone wanting to discuss real LA's would do better there. Line arrays are very different than regular DIY audio. They do have rules to prevent comb filter distortion, about the speaker placement, about the power required, etc. You can't just slap a few speakers together. And they take a huge amount of time to build. And finally, unlike point source audio, the sum of the parts are often much greater than a simple addition of the parts.
And so it goes. But I have to move on now. Good Luck Jin in your search. Hope to hear from you privately.
Zarathu
calipso@epix.net
unless phisical measurements aren't done correctly,
the only way to actually see if a proper line array is on par or better than a lesser quantity arrangement would be to do an A-B with the exact same driver used
and a construction that would yield the approximate same system.
that would be very hard i believe
so until then, still on to they +and - of arrays VS
"point source" oriented design
By how much does using multiple same driver reduces the distortion ?
in HT we usualy run at higher SPL than when listening to music, so it might have a greater impact on distortion when pushing the drivers more ??
the only way to actually see if a proper line array is on par or better than a lesser quantity arrangement would be to do an A-B with the exact same driver used
and a construction that would yield the approximate same system.
that would be very hard i believe
so until then, still on to they +and - of arrays VS
"point source" oriented design
By how much does using multiple same driver reduces the distortion ?
in HT we usualy run at higher SPL than when listening to music, so it might have a greater impact on distortion when pushing the drivers more ??
Cameron : what is with the dual concentric ?
please explain to me what is the diff with the drivers you are pointing at and regular drivers ..
and i don't understand your directivity thing with dipole?? are dipole arrangement less directional ?
i seriously thought that it was on the contrairy, limiting the side waves because of the annulation of the waves meating at 90deg and 270deg on the sides ..
please elaborate
Zuruthutaluluratu : i don't konw how you can miss the 200+ projects that users here have done with line arrays... i have learned about the existence of arrays in here, and i have seen 100+ threads on projects based on arrays ...
don't try and sell me to some technologies or some specific drivers guys, i can do that part by myself.
what i want/need are facts,requirements, things to look for in my planning ..
please explain to me what is the diff with the drivers you are pointing at and regular drivers ..
and i don't understand your directivity thing with dipole?? are dipole arrangement less directional ?
i seriously thought that it was on the contrairy, limiting the side waves because of the annulation of the waves meating at 90deg and 270deg on the sides ..
please elaborate
Zuruthutaluluratu : i don't konw how you can miss the 200+ projects that users here have done with line arrays... i have learned about the existence of arrays in here, and i have seen 100+ threads on projects based on arrays ...
don't try and sell me to some technologies or some specific drivers guys, i can do that part by myself.
what i want/need are facts,requirements, things to look for in my planning ..