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-   -   How is Behringer NU6000 delivering 1500RMS into 8ohms with IRS2092s? (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/class-d/313782-behringer-nu6000-delivering-1500rms-8ohms-irs2092s.html)

rhythmsandy 21st October 2017 04:55 PM

How is Behringer NU6000 delivering 1500RMS into 8ohms with IRS2092s?
 
I could get this schematic on some online website
Dropbox - behringer_nu3000_nu6000_sm.pdf
I was going through how come IRS2092 with +/-82V able to deliver 1500RMS into 8 ohms. Even if two channels of the IRS2092 amp is bridged each at +/-82V how will it be able to deliver 1500RMS into 8 and 3000 into 4ohms?

Antana 21st October 2017 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhythmsandy (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/class-d/313782-behringer-nu6000-delivering-1500rms-8ohms-irs2092s-post5219976.html#post5219976)
I could get this schematic on some online website
Dropbox - behringer_nu3000_nu6000_sm.pdf
I was going through how come IRS2092 with +/-82V able to deliver 1500RMS into 8 ohms. Even if two channels of the IRS2092 amp is bridged each at +/-82V how will it be able to deliver 1500RMS into 8 and 3000 into 4ohms?

Vē / R? So +/-82V is 164V p-p. 164 / 1.41 = 116V RMS. Over 8 ohm's gives 1691 Wrms. Naturally there are losses, but 1500Wrms is doable. Or do I make a mistake?

ICG 23rd October 2017 04:59 AM

It does less than that in reality. YouTube amp dyno

Eva 25th October 2017 04:33 AM

It does, for few dozen milliseconds, until the unregulated PSU output drops or enters hiccup mode, safety limiting kicks in, and things get hot.

In fact, I can recognize the hints of some marketing text I wrote, a few years ago, for more powerful and rugged amplifiers (that can do rated power for seconds before limiting), in the ads of these cheap amplifiers (and others). Nowadays the marketing is being copied too, but with a difference, the text I wrote was telling the truth. The copiers know no truth. They are like cameras taking and selling pictures of whatever they like. But the essence of things is far more ample than capturing static images.

Khron 25th October 2017 12:23 PM

That sort of reminds me of one of AvE's sayings (over on Youtube) - "If a picture's worth a thousand words, a movie's worth a million"...

ICG 26th October 2017 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eva (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/class-d/313782-behringer-nu6000-delivering-1500rms-8ohms-irs2092s-post5223428.html#post5223428)
It does, for few dozen milliseconds, until the unregulated PSU output drops or enters hiccup mode, safety limiting kicks in, and things get hot.

Nope, it does not. The amp was tested with several different test modes and one of them was the burst mode test which signal consists of 20ms 1kHz burst, followed of 480ms silence (like described in the IHF-A-202/IEC60268 specs), which resulted in less than 1300W per channel (1252W & 1239W, to be precise). That means it does, in fact, not deliver that power for 'a few dozend ms' or actually any relevant period of time.
It was not a 'monday-amp' either, other tests revealed there are examples which only able to deliver a bit over 1100W per channel at 8 Ohm.

It's not a horrible amp, still one of the better 'bang for the buck' choices but it simply does not deliver what it promises. A lot other amps don't do that either but sometimes it's worth investing a little bit more.

Eva 26th October 2017 08:20 AM

Well, it does rated *peak* power for few *or* dozen milliseconds. The question is: Why so much inflation? Isn't it good enough to be the well known bang-for-the-buck brand?

esgigt 26th October 2017 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ICG (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/class-d/313782-behringer-nu6000-delivering-1500rms-8ohms-irs2092s-post5224613.html#post5224613)
Nope, it does not. The amp was tested with several different test modes and one of them was the burst mode test which signal consists of 20ms 1kHz burst, followed of 480ms silence (like described in the IHF-A-202/IEC60268 specs), which resulted in less than 1300W per channel (1252W & 1239W, to be precise). That means it does, in fact, not deliver that power for 'a few dozend ms' or actually any relevant period of time.
It was not a 'monday-amp' either, other tests revealed there are examples which only able to deliver a bit over 1100W per channel at 8 Ohm.

It's not a horrible amp, still one of the better 'bang for the buck' choices but it simply does not deliver what it promises. A lot other amps don't do that either but sometimes it's worth investing a little bit more.

I've seen that 1300W test too... And it makes me wonder under which testing-conditions Behringer measured the output power they claimed. Under "normal" operation conditions the claimed power proves to be an illusion. ( marketing guys are very bad people and ought to be jailed for that)

The other measurements prove that the amp would deliver if it had been specified as a 1000W/Ch. amp.

ICG 26th October 2017 11:07 PM

Behringer got a lot of very good products like the DCX2496 Ultradrive controller (best sold, most used DSP over here) or the X32 digital mixer which are very competitive in price and performance. So I don't see why they have to rightout lie about the specs, it would still be a very good deal with the actual power output. They aren't the only ones though, even a hefty price tag does not alway guarantees you get the promised performance. I guess in the times of facebook and Trump the ones win who are the noisiest, sad but true. :(

Surprisingly, some brands actually deliver more than they promise though, i.e. the Thomann Proline 3000, which is by far not the top of the price range of the amps but rock solid, stable and relyable.

Eva 28th October 2017 01:49 AM

Unfortunately that t.amp Proline 3000 is class H and is made up of 37kg of natural resources whose extraction and processing provokes about 10~20 times more disease and war than a cost optimized class D amplifier doing 750W/kg continuous and 2kW/kg for few seconds. (This is an affordable attainable ratio, requiring dedication, though.)

I have a Spanish word for that: "Mastodonte". For this case meaning something like: that the "project" got "fed" (ma)ternally yet (st)ubbornly, so gr(o)wth happened as a si(d)e effect, then it continued gr(o)wing , it got i(n)creasingly huge, turning agains(t) its cr(e)ators.


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