off-the-shelf amplifier suggestions for Alpairs

[tdr1213]

What's the appropriate amp for MA Alpairs fr speakers?

I want to make some speakers and I understand that my receiver (yamaha htr 5940) is very poor indeed.

I have searched quite a bit - but not finding anything clear. Suggestions? Thanks.

 

[markaudio]

Hi tdr1213,
Thanks for asking this question as it's very timely. As you may have seen from the other thread on this Markaudio section, there's both up-grades to existing driver and prototypes. We're at the stage where most of these drivers are being run on various amps to see how they behave.

I'll expand more on this very soon but for now, here's pics of amps that we find to be an excellent match:

Tony Wong's 6V6 4 watt - Pentode with Triode connections currently powering Alp5, Alp6, Alp7 and Alp 10 protos
Tony Wong's EL84 12 watt-push-bull -Currently powering Alp 10 (existing model) Alp7 and Alp 12
I also use a Sansui AU-a907-DR Mofset for current model Alpair 10 and Alpair 12

There's more to say but must dash.

Cheers

Mark.

 

[planet10]

4 watts is probably a little light except for a real small room, but i bet its sounds good within its limits. If it is enuff, El Cheapo TubeLab SimpleSE, or the Music Machine would be diy choices.

I'd suggest that almost any of the gain clones, maybe the better class D amplifiers will outgun your HT receiver. Any number of the diy tube amps (Red Light District, Baby Huey) will do really well. For more power something like Gregg-the-Geeks DynaMutt (what i'm currently using does do very well)

Any of the Pass clones would be a good choice too.

dave

 

[markaudio]

I have searched quite a bit - but not finding anything clear. Suggestions? Thanks.

Hi trd,
Assuming you plan to keep the Yam and get a second amp for the stereo music? If this is the case, what's you're amp budget? Or, are you going to ditch the Yam and start again?
Also, how's big is your listening room LxWxH?

Cheers

Mark.

 

[Musik007]

Hi Mark,

6V6 is power tetrode and EL84 is power pentode. This mini 6V6 amp is under single end class A circuit. The plate voltage of 6V6 is 250V in the amp and the plate current is 35 Ma. EF95/5654/6AK5/WE403B is a low noise RF voltage amplifying pentode with miniature 7 pins. We adjusted the plate voltage of EF95 at 140V in the amp and the plate current at 2 Ma. The pentode EF95 is under triode connection for 6V6 single end circuit. The reason is 6V6 is easy to be driven and if EF95 is under pentode connection, the gain ratio will be too high, but if under triode connection, the gain ratio will not be so high. Many people like the sound of triode and believe it is sweeter and warmer than pentode.

Tony.

 

[tdr1213]

Hi trd,
Assuming you plan to keep the Yam and get a second amp for the stereo music? If this is the case, what's you're amp budget? Or, are you going to ditch the Yam and start again?
Also, how's big is your listening room LxWxH?

Cheers

Mark.

The room is 34’x25’x8’. Open concept with living room, kitchen, and dining room kinda all together.

I would like to build an amp and could easily ditch the yam, whatever makes the most sense. I watch tv, movies, and listen to music via itunes from a htpc.

I would like minimal components – simply a htpc, an amp, and two speakers to handle all my music and movie audio needs. Not sure this is realistic. Let me know.

Budget….hmmm..... $500? I really have no clue what an amp costs. This is my first effort – maybe there’s some beginners kit out there. If this works out, I could build a better one for the man cave.

I mostly listen to country and pop music and usually not loud, wanna save those ears ya know.

 

[planet10]

For a beginners kit, a gainclone (peter (audiosector) or Brian (chipamp.com)) if SS -- i like the 1875. A tube amp will probably cost more and be a bit more work, i'd suspect a PP would be more appropriate but the TubelabSE might well be the easiest. Getting lucky and finding a good donor amp can shift the cost of tube amp considerably

dave

 

[markaudio]

The room is 34’x25’x8’. Open concept with living room, kitchen, and dining room kinda all together.
I would like to build an amp and could easily ditch the yam, whatever makes the most sense. I watch tv, movies, and listen to music via itunes from a htpc.
I would like minimal components – simply a htpc, an amp, and two speakers to handle all my music and movie audio needs. Not sure this is realistic. Let me know.
Budget….hmmm..... $500? I really have no clue what an amp costs. This is my first effort – maybe there’s some beginners kit out there. If this works out, I could build a better one for the man cave.
I mostly listen to country and pop music and usually not loud, wanna save those ears ya know.

I should have asked if you already have Markaudio drivers, I'll assume not for now. Your room's a fairly big so for sort of listening you've mentioned. I'd suggest Alpair 10 or better still, Alpair 12. It's worth taking a look at this thread:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/markaudio/155511-alpair-12-damped-air-coupler-box-design.html

The Pencil 12 is an easy build, smooth on the ears, easy adjust by adding or subtracting the damping material. Its principle of operation makes it ideal for the larger room sizes.

On to amps. So you're easy on your ears, very wise! I'd suggest the following:

1 - Tube amps, a 300B single end around 8 watts or for a bit more power an EL84 pull-pull. More power still takes you to KT-88 push pull. The 300B is possibly the nicer of these options but good 300B tubes cost more. Good transformers and components will also cost for 300B. This choice might take you beyond the 300B if you want to do a nice job. The EL-84 is a nice compromise. Transformers are smaller and components should be easily sourced at affordable prices. 4 X EL84 tubes in push-pull is enough power and tube prices are more affordable. Going to KT-88 may be a bit of over-kill on power.

2 - If the budget can't stretch quite so far and the kit idea becomes too challenging, keep an eye out on Ebay and alike for anyone selling off their project. Could be your lucky day. I recommend searching for the tube amps types I've mentioned. But also any Sansui 907 series and Sony Taf-333EX or 555EX series Mofsets. Sometimes, these amps pop up for moderate money and provided they've been looked after, will do you some musical justice.

Try to avoid buying into a cheap tube kit. With $500 bucks as the budget, this rout may be tempting but risky as you may be restricted on the quality of the components. Watch out for some of the cheap "Chinese built" tube amps. They look good but their components aren't up to much. While others China brands are good but the cost is up.

You could drop a line to member Tony (Musik007). He may be able to help and advise. One thing for sure, Tony and Thomas know their amp onions so feel free to ask.

Finally, take another look at your source. Assuming you're mainly using CD's, up-grading the CD should also be on your future shopping list if like me, you rely on an ageing CD player. I recently up-graded to a used Accuphase DP-65, wow what a difference!

Hope this helps, feel free to ask more

Cheers

Mark.

 

[markaudio]

For a beginners kit, a gainclone (peter (audiosector) or Brian (chipamp.com)) if SS -- i like the 1875.
dave

Dave's idea is also worth exploring.

Going down the chip-a rout, also, talk to Michael at: Power Amp Kits by AmpsLab

Michael's gear looks very interesting. His Bi70Mk2 and Lm60 kits could be interesting. I've not tried them myself so tell him: Alpair 12 drivers or whatever choice you've got or going for.

Cheers

Mark

 

[Scottmoose]

I would also suggest any of Nelson Pass's DIY designs. If you can weild a soldering iron, you're in business. Probably, in this case, one of these would be my pick:

http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/sonofzen.pdf -the Son of Zen amp
http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/zen-v6.pdf -modification to the above
http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/zen-v7.pdf -further modification of the above
http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/zen-v5-hires.pdf -something a little different

 

[tdr1213]

Lots of great info. Thanks all! l will research out these amps and prices and see what I can do.

tim

 

[Scottmoose]

Good luck with whatever you decide upon. If you can handle the DIY approach, that's where your best performance / £ lies, although there are several good commercial suggestions here.

 

[tdr1213]

Good luck with whatever you decide upon. If you can handle the DIY approach, that's where your best performance / £ lies, although there are several good commercial suggestions here.

I am not sure what kind of trouble I'm gonna get myself into - but I want to try the diy route. Now I'm tryng to discern which amp in the suggestion list is the best value for the dollar. Reading and learning a lot.

tim

 

[markaudio]

Hi Tim,
A quick note to wish you all the best. As you're going DIY, I'd suggest looking for a simple project since its your first attempt. Possibly Dave's and Scott's ideas may be the best rout. Or Michael at Ampslab. Its good idea to pick your MA driver choice. As a starting guide:

Alpair 10 and 12 - look at: 8 watts or more on tube SET, 12 watts or more on tube push-pull. 30 watts up on most solid state.

We've been driving new Proto Alpair-10's that have light-mass coils with ease on a Tetrode 4 Watt 6V6 from Tony Wong. But I'm still experimenting so it's not a given that these coils will find there way into production:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/markaudio/158417-alpair-10-generation-2-sneak-peek.html

Tubes are really nice, lots of vintage choices but you might want to think about investing a bit more money if you go this rout.

You might want to seek more in-depth advice from the Amps section of this forum: Amplifiers - diyAudio

Cheers,

Mark.

 

[Henkjan]

I would also like to add the UcD amps (class D). I have made an active loudspeaker with the Alpair5 (supported by a bass) that used the Hypex UcD and the result was excelent, never heard so much details in music before. I used a plate amp type (2 channel amp with DSP). But there are build your self sets available that do not require a lot of electronics skills except connecting the right wires

But on the other hand, the small monitors I made with the CHR70 never sounded better than on a tube amp (sorry, I forgot which, I tried them on a DIY event)... Also a friend tested my Alpair10 horns on his tube amps and loved them. So Alpair and tubes do go together very well..

Just make sure that whatever amp you choose, that it is capable of reproducing the fine details of music very well, for otherwise you're not getting the most out of the Alpairs. I once read an excelent article by Menno van der Veen on this, explaining what designs in tube amps would influence this, it was in the dutch Elektor magazine. If this cannot be assured from design or independent reviews and/or user experiences, the best is to test them once you have youre speakers ready.

 

[omegaspeedy]

My Alpair 7's are sounding very promising in a run-in test cab at the moment via my Dayens Ampino so can also recommend this combo.

 

[human.bin]

I would also like to add the UcD amps (class D).

guys, any of you has experience with the apogee DDX amps? a board to experiment with can be obtained quite cheaply and it will do 50W with direct digital input, so no DAC no cd-player thing to care about, i was contemplating them for the alpair-10.