Hi, im searching for the design of a speaker that i can use in my coming home cinema room. i've looked upon a few designs, but havent found the perfect one for my needs yet, i think.
i want the speaker to be capable of high, clean and dynamic output, up to somewhere around 110+db maybe (measured 1m from speaker). i want natural sound. it doesnt have to go any deep at all, since i have 3 12" subs to take care of the lower frequencies.
and of course, i want it to not be too expensive, preferably somewhere in the 400£@pair-range.
the first design i have looked upon is this . the problem is that its a little expensive (liveable, but i want it preferably a little cheaper) and im not sure about how much output i can get from them. considering the low thermal power handling of the XG18 and the low efficency (85db).
then i have looked at a norwegian design using two 5" Vifa TC and a Vifa 1" D26NC-15-06 in an MTM config. i love the price, but i really doubt i can get enough output with only two 5" pr speaker. or do you think it could play loud enough if i cross over to the subs at 100-80hz? by loud i mean pretty loud cinema sound, but not so loud that it gets annoying
the last i have looked upon is another norwegian design using two Silverflute W17RC38-S, 6.5", one YAG-20 ribbon tweeter and a Hivi K1 as ambience. this one probably meets my output criterias, but im a little sceptic to the yag-20 tweeter. as it has got really bad reviews some places.
so what do you think? any thoughts or comments on the design ive listed? any other ideas?
Øyvind
i want the speaker to be capable of high, clean and dynamic output, up to somewhere around 110+db maybe (measured 1m from speaker). i want natural sound. it doesnt have to go any deep at all, since i have 3 12" subs to take care of the lower frequencies.
and of course, i want it to not be too expensive, preferably somewhere in the 400£@pair-range.
the first design i have looked upon is this . the problem is that its a little expensive (liveable, but i want it preferably a little cheaper) and im not sure about how much output i can get from them. considering the low thermal power handling of the XG18 and the low efficency (85db).
then i have looked at a norwegian design using two 5" Vifa TC and a Vifa 1" D26NC-15-06 in an MTM config. i love the price, but i really doubt i can get enough output with only two 5" pr speaker. or do you think it could play loud enough if i cross over to the subs at 100-80hz? by loud i mean pretty loud cinema sound, but not so loud that it gets annoying
the last i have looked upon is another norwegian design using two Silverflute W17RC38-S, 6.5", one YAG-20 ribbon tweeter and a Hivi K1 as ambience. this one probably meets my output criterias, but im a little sceptic to the yag-20 tweeter. as it has got really bad reviews some places.
so what do you think? any thoughts or comments on the design ive listed? any other ideas?
Øyvind
skogs said:
Hi Øyvind,
If you choose the main frequency driver that gives you that output (usually max. is on the 100/102dBs) for that price, there you are on the right path.
£400,00 / $807,00 / €591,00.
You can cross the main reference spectrum with a good power mid woofer.
What is your plan?
Please post references of your subs to the forum.
Look here for a good mid-woofer not more than 100dBs. To go up from here you need horns also on the mid section with cone drivers or compression drivers. Please be more specific.
http://www.monacor.com/int/en/produktseite_stageline.php?artid=80&spr=EN&typ=u
or MID 98dB - SP-10A-302PA
http://www.monacor-spain.net/modules.php?name=Buscar_Producto&file=ficha&Articulo=SP-10A/302PA
On the soft side you have
SPH-210 - Monacor 8 HiFi bass-midrange (90dBs)
http://www.bmm-electronics.com/brands.asp?ID1=1&ID2=6
http://www.bmm-electronics.com/Product.asp?Product_ID=3544
I hope you enjoy it.
Hi! im sorry, i forgot to mention, i dont need the sensitivity to be as high as that, i just need a speaker that can give me around maksimum 110db with for example an 100W amplifier! so the sensitivity should preferably be aound 90db. im sorry i didnt make that clear
the subs im going to use is 1 TC2+ 12" in a 200L box@18hz tuning, then another TC12+ 12" in a 100L box@22hz, and the last one is a peerless xxls in a small closed box. the TC's will get around 500Wrms@8ohm each and the peerless 250Wrms@4ohm.
this will probably give me a pretty good spl, around 115db+ i guess, and i want the speakers to follow them as much as possible without distorting. (off course i dont expect them to follow all the way, due to my budget, and sound quality is also very important!)
the speakers will just have to be able to play down to 60-70hz.
the subs im going to use is 1 TC2+ 12" in a 200L box@18hz tuning, then another TC12+ 12" in a 100L box@22hz, and the last one is a peerless xxls in a small closed box. the TC's will get around 500Wrms@8ohm each and the peerless 250Wrms@4ohm.
this will probably give me a pretty good spl, around 115db+ i guess, and i want the speakers to follow them as much as possible without distorting. (off course i dont expect them to follow all the way, due to my budget, and sound quality is also very important!)
the speakers will just have to be able to play down to 60-70hz.
Hi Skogs,
I think you are right to select on the basis of effective maximum loudness.
I also think your target is about right for a domestic system. Athough Musical Fidelity are currently promoting 110db at the seating position as the minimum for high quality sound reproduction. It fits with their position as an amplifier manufacturer.
To achieve that 110db/m you rightly identified 100W and 90db/W/m.
Now, try finding good quality drivers that can match your requirement. Not easy.
I think you need to look at higher sensitivity drivers to get your 110db and achieve SQ as well.
50W and 93db/W/m is achieveable for midrange drivers. But don't go too big, as I think you get into beaming and breakup issues when the cone sizes get into the very high sensitivity range.
25W and 96db/W/m may be asking too much for treble drivers.
10W and 100db/W/m is achievable but at highish cost.
Good luck with your searches.
BTW,
have you used WINisd to check the 20Hz output level of your bass and/or sub-bass drivers/boxes? >=115db/m from 12inchers would indeed be tremendous, but I don't know if you can get that down at 20Hz from that size of driver.
I think you are right to select on the basis of effective maximum loudness.
I also think your target is about right for a domestic system. Athough Musical Fidelity are currently promoting 110db at the seating position as the minimum for high quality sound reproduction. It fits with their position as an amplifier manufacturer.
To achieve that 110db/m you rightly identified 100W and 90db/W/m.
Now, try finding good quality drivers that can match your requirement. Not easy.
I think you need to look at higher sensitivity drivers to get your 110db and achieve SQ as well.
50W and 93db/W/m is achieveable for midrange drivers. But don't go too big, as I think you get into beaming and breakup issues when the cone sizes get into the very high sensitivity range.
25W and 96db/W/m may be asking too much for treble drivers.
10W and 100db/W/m is achievable but at highish cost.
Good luck with your searches.
BTW,
have you used WINisd to check the 20Hz output level of your bass and/or sub-bass drivers/boxes? >=115db/m from 12inchers would indeed be tremendous, but I don't know if you can get that down at 20Hz from that size of driver.
http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Proteus.html
AKA a Wilson cub clone.
Ditch the ports and make a less deep sealed version.
/sreten.
AKA a Wilson cub clone.
Ditch the ports and make a less deep sealed version.
/sreten.- Status
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