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No regulator for best sound?
No regulator for best sound?
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Old 1st November 2017, 01:26 AM   #41
anatech is offline anatech  Canada
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No regulator for best sound?
Hi Phase,
I would say that if an amp picks up normal noise on a line, it is a bad design. Most audio equipment I have seen is fairly poorly designed.

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Old 1st November 2017, 05:15 PM   #42
phase is online now phase  United States
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I do agree with the normal noise, and how most equipment readily allows that from not enough isolation or filtering or whatever.
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Old 5th November 2017, 03:09 PM   #43
lucpes is offline lucpes  Romania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phase View Post
I do agree with the normal noise, and how most equipment readily allows that from not enough isolation or filtering or whatever.
Anybody tried CLC filtering?
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Old 5th November 2017, 04:07 PM   #44
phase is online now phase  United States
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I think that equipment designs which incorporate a succession of circuits, that each stage leaves opportunity for gains in performance. The power supply obviously starts with the mains, so that is where I start messing with things.

I have seen commercial amps that advertise a higher output, mostly at lower impedance loads by only increasing the size of the transformer and filter caps. This was with an older SCS mosfet amp from about 30 years ago. Not sure if the sound quality is improved, would think so with the right speakers, less with a higher impedance load...

I can appreciate how a good power supply helps, however it is made.
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Old 5th November 2017, 04:30 PM   #45
anatech is offline anatech  Canada
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No regulator for best sound?
Hi lucpes,
Yes, many people. It was normal to design power supplies like this in the very early days, but later on we had better and less expensive devices to choose from. We can approximate an infinitely large inductance with a series regulator fairly cheaply. From a distribution standpoint, the extra weight of chokes will kill you on shipping and damage claims. From a technical standpoint, electronic systems should give you a lower noise and more stable voltage source for your circuitry. Kind of a push-pull situation towards electronic regulators.

You wouldn't like the cost or performance of a C-L-C ... type filter in products you buy. However, at high switching frequencies where the magnetics can be much smaller, the situation is reversed. Electronic regulators have a more difficult time rejecting high frequencies and this is where an inductor can out-perform an electronic regulator. Things aren't quite that clear-cut, but with switching power supplies you will see LC filters, possibly followed with an electronic regulator.

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Old 5th November 2017, 05:12 PM   #46
Chris888 is offline Chris888  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucpes View Post
Anybody tried CLC filtering?
I've used such things very successfully in other contexts, but in an audio amp, the 'L' is going to add impedance within the audio band, unless we are just talking an RF choke or a pi filter well above the audio bandwidth.
But sometimes that's OK, what you want to do is isolate different circuit sections which are fed by the same rail.
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Old 5th November 2017, 05:58 PM   #47
Bigun is offline Bigun  Canada
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No regulator for best sound?
The trick is ensuring the 'C' provides a sufficiently low impedance across the audio band. Obviously that isn't down to d.c.
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Old 18th November 2017, 01:33 AM   #48
hollowman is offline hollowman  United States
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Originally Posted by hollowman View Post
Didn't break out my 'scope ... yet ... but I may in a few days....

Anyway, exclusively for the I/V, I'm now using a totally-external PSU based on the tracking pre-regulator tweaked by Martin Clark. The dedicated xformer is a small Amveco toroidal.
Most important, the new reg. is outputting 18.5v with super-clean <1.0mV ripple (read with my Fluke 87 DMM on 'AC')

The sound?
Definite improvement in most aspects [compared to un-regulated DC]. Most aspects except ...
Still not sure un-regulated is still superior to the upgrade noted above (and shown in pics below).
That said, the very good sonics with unreg. output stage is praiseworthy -- especially given its economy (i.e., no of parts, and all being stock).

Note that the PSU of new reg. is completely independent from CDPs power (note the separate power cord).

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
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Last edited by hollowman; 18th November 2017 at 01:36 AM.
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