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Old 16th November 2012, 11:43 AM   #41
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It is possible to destroy any Music Rail if a dead short is switched in. There is overload protection, but no protection against a dead short. Otherwise it is possible to destroy it if the Music Rail latches up. This can happen if the input is not bypassed or if certain small values of output capacitance are present.There is some other problem causing the loss of output. Can you measure the noise on the MR output ?. Try using a scope or sensitive AC meter. It should be lower than 10mV. What is the noise at the MR input ?. Also, compare the input noise vs output noise with a scope. Do you see an oscillation at the MR output ?
Ensure that the output noise is lower than the input noise, and that there is no sinewave or oscillation present on the output. A scope should show just a small band of noise on the highest level of magnification.
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Old 16th November 2012, 12:26 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SY View Post
Sorry to disagree. Many of his products are indeed cargo cult pseudo-science frauds. This particular one is a straightforward regulator with mediocre performance.
You didn't work out which product I was discussing, did you.

My overwhelming impression of this.company is that they either sell nonsense, OR perfectly good products marketed with added nonsense as a way to charge enormously over the odds.

Either way they should be ashamed of themselves.
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Old 16th November 2012, 12:55 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Krzysztof View Post
It is possible to destroy any Music Rail if a dead short is switched in. There is overload protection, but no protection against a dead short. Otherwise it is possible to destroy it if the Music Rail latches up. This can happen if the input is not bypassed or if certain small values of output capacitance are present.There is some other problem causing the loss of output. Can you measure the noise on the MR output ?. Try using a scope or sensitive AC meter. It should be lower than 10mV. What is the noise at the MR input ?. Also, compare the input noise vs output noise with a scope. Do you see an oscillation at the MR output ?
Ensure that the output noise is lower than the input noise, and that there is no sinewave or oscillation present on the output. A scope should show just a small band of noise on the highest level of magnification.
No dead short at any time. No small values of capacitance at the output. There was aprox 90 uf.
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Old 16th November 2012, 02:11 PM   #44
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Erlend, something definitely went WRONG. Perhaps, a bad connection, however, once you start raising the voltage above 30V or so, (not 60 like I first thought), you CAN destroy the device, IF it is not wired properly.
Of course, it MIGHT be defective, but this is a device that I am pretty sure is pre-tested before shipping.
For the record, it is basically an IC op amp that does the heavy work, the rest of the voltage about 30V is taken up by a Zener diode.
Dimitri, who is on this website, might be able to give you further input on this device.
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Old 16th November 2012, 06:35 PM   #45
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John I am sure nothing was mounted wrong. I took everything out and there is nothing wrong with the amp.

Hope Dimitri will pass here.

One thing for sure I do not dare to modifie the Mark Levinson 29 with this.

Last edited by Erlend Sæterdal; 16th November 2012 at 06:38 PM.
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Old 16th November 2012, 06:38 PM   #46
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Off topic, but does this Bybee Music Rails device actually produce measurable improvement?
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Old 16th November 2012, 06:54 PM   #47
SY is offline SY  United States
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Yes, but not to the level of a decent regulator. See Jack Walton's article in Linear Audio Vol 4.
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Old 16th November 2012, 06:56 PM   #48
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you must be using some pretty badly described regulators, the info in the datasheet is very limited. they do not touch on dynamic behavior, which I would think pretty important if it cant deal with capacitance on its output. It has no noise or impedance vs frequency graphs etc. . the pics (fig.8) showing application do not look very conducive to low noise either, point to point with no ground plane or a return closely coupled to the output which goes through a huge film cap, looks like a dipole aerial to me.

use something like that in a dac or near a switchmode supply it could easily resemble a repeater station
You really do like to have the last word don't you (pot kettle):-). However have you ever studied the characteristics of a Jung super regulator or variations thereof? If you have you will know that they are very twitchy regarding output capacitors, anything with too low an ESR asks for oscillation.
Any way my point is solely that the Bybee should not be condemned by this fact alone.

Secondly, I agree fig 8 has an extremely wide loop area but it is an illustration of a high voltage application, not particularly likely to be used in a DAC but not at all atypical of tube circuits or even power amps where one often sees filter caps many centimetres from the output devices and equally remote from a ground point. Not that I condone such practices of course!
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Old 16th November 2012, 07:03 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by SY View Post
Yes, but not to the level of a decent regulator. See Jack Walton's article in Linear Audio Vol 4.
I wonder if you are looking at these devices for their intended use? The bybees seem to me to be a convenient add on to improve existing supplies. If one were building a supply from scratch, an actual voltage regulator, which the bybee is not, may well be the superior solution.

I must buy that issue of Linear audio, that article sounds fascinating.
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Old 16th November 2012, 07:06 PM   #50
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Of course, you are correct, Robert. The Music Rails only REDUCE noise, they don't regulate the DC. However, they are inherently very quiet, much quieter than most lab supplies.
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