Apogee and Magnepan woofer panels - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Planars & Exotics

Planars & Exotics ESL's, planars, and alternative technologies

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 25th January 2014, 01:35 PM   #1
john65b is offline john65b  United States
diyAudio Member
 
john65b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago
Default Apogee and Magnepan woofer panels

Hey all, just noticed that magnepan and Apogee woofers panels are a bit different in their placement of conductor - Magnepan has conductor wire directly between the N-S magnets, while Apogee has centerline of the ribbon conductors directly over the edges of the N-S magnets.

I would guess that Apogee design not having the ribbon conductor centerline directly between the N-S magnets would compromise their performance, and make it non linear?

See pics...
Attached Images
File Type: png US4550228-3.png (249.4 KB, 177 views)
File Type: jpg Planar_01.jpg (38.2 KB, 161 views)
__________________
All right, but apart from the sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us? Life of Brian
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 01:48 PM   #2
a.wayne is offline a.wayne  United States
Sin Bin
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Front Row Center
Apogee's were superior sounding in every way , they were sued by Magnapan for patent infringement and Magnapan won. Both setups with mags on one side would suffer from NL, (maggie) current , push pull setup is superior in regards to NL ....
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 02:03 PM   #3
john65b is offline john65b  United States
diyAudio Member
 
john65b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago
Yes, I agree a Push-Pull would be ideal, but maggies and Apogees were more like Push-Don't Push? I was referring to having the conductor directly between the poles as opposed to a bit off to the side...

Anyway, Magnepan sued Apogee over the Diva True Ribbon Tweeter design, I don't think anything else was in question...

What would be lost/gained if instead of a ribbon on Apogee panel, you had an Aluminum wire like magnepan?
__________________
All right, but apart from the sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us? Life of Brian
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 02:28 PM   #4
tyu is offline tyu  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
So was the Diva True Ribbon tweeter.....free hanging??... like all others Apogees..........YES!

Magnepans socaled true ribbon is tacket down evey 4"s....i hear an see a big diff. in the setups...but i gess foil is foil............
I have Maggy here an there a lot of fun...but there in that 75-80% at best to full ribbon or ESLs....but there not even close to the any Apogee............

Last edited by tyu; 25th January 2014 at 02:31 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 03:13 PM   #5
diyAudio Member
 
DeltaStar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Handel SK
I wouldn't call it a true hanging ribbon, it is glued to a foam dampner about every foot and half or so.
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 03:42 PM   #6
a.wayne is offline a.wayne  United States
Sin Bin
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Front Row Center
Quote:
Originally Posted by john65b View Post
Yes, I agree a Push-Pull would be ideal, but maggies and Apogees were more like Push-Don't Push? I was referring to having the conductor directly between the poles as opposed to a bit off to the side...

Anyway, Magnepan sued Apogee over the Diva True Ribbon Tweeter design, I don't think anything else was in question...

What would be lost/gained if instead of a ribbon on Apogee panel, you had an Aluminum wire like magnepan?
I thought the new Maggies were push/pull ...?


Edit: nope i was not able to see if so from their website , IMO the apps had superior bass , with more drive with magnets behind, you will get more of a twisting motion the way maggie has them ...

Last edited by a.wayne; 25th January 2014 at 03:54 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 04:37 PM   #7
john65b is offline john65b  United States
diyAudio Member
 
john65b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago
The 20 series are push-pull (have perforated sheets on both sides of the diaphragm), but the 3.x and 2.x and 1.x series are still all push - don't push.
__________________
All right, but apart from the sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us? Life of Brian
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 05:38 PM   #8
a.wayne is offline a.wayne  United States
Sin Bin
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Front Row Center
Ok, thats what i thought .....
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 08:28 PM   #9
john65b is offline john65b  United States
diyAudio Member
 
john65b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chicago
Hey, I have been thinking about the Apogee Buzz and have a theory...

I think the buzz is from the speaker being over driven - look at this way - Kapton shrinks as it gets hot - I have read 8% in 15 minutes at 70C (155F). Now I have put my hands on ribbons and they can get pretty toasty - when the Aluminum gets hot it expands, while the Kaption shrinks, bowing the ribbon. Once cool, the aluminum returns back to normal, while the Kapton remains shrunk. This bowing appears as wrinkles that I think can cause the buzz more than the sides slapping on the blocks when the foam disintegrates.

What do you all think??
__________________
All right, but apart from the sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us? Life of Brian

Last edited by john65b; 25th January 2014 at 08:31 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 25th January 2014, 10:30 PM   #10
WrineX is offline WrineX  Netherlands
diyAudio Member
 
WrineX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Den Haag
Only midrange panels of high end magnepan are push pull. Not the bass! The amount of air that should pass the holes is to high any way or dampening to high. Maggie is using the resonance to extend low freq.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Anyone making Apogee bass panels ? artm Planars & Exotics 74 18th August 2014 01:10 PM
Apogee Centaur Woofer upgrade Rozz Multi-Way 25 30th March 2014 01:21 PM
Magnepan Tympani Bass Panels john65b Swap Meet 3 12th September 2012 04:59 PM
Any thoughts on mixing magnepan and apogee? martyh Planars & Exotics 4 25th February 2010 11:27 PM
Apogee Major woofer repair ledroit Planars & Exotics 1 3rd January 2010 03:32 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 03:40 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2