Some More Questions On ELS Design - Page 11 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Planars & Exotics

Planars & Exotics ESL's, planars, and alternative technologies

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12th January 2012, 07:44 AM   #101
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: wigston leics england
And somebody said it was easier and cheaper to build full range ESL's than FULL RANGE PLANARS!!?
__________________
HENRY
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th January 2012, 08:43 AM   #102
SM7UYJ is offline SM7UYJ  Sweden
diyAudio Member
 
SM7UYJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Staffanstorp
Nice work!

I feel absolutely no envy for your having a work shop like that!

Realy looking forward to seeing your speakers when you get them up and running.

Have you done any measurements of the panels/transformers yet?

Keep up the good work and keep us posted!

/R
__________________
The probability of someone watching you is proportional to the stupidity of your action.
- A. Kindsvater
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th January 2012, 03:41 PM   #103
fperra is offline fperra  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lakewood, WA
When I have everything finished I'll start doing some measurements. This is going to be a 3 way, electronically crossed over system using a dynamic woofer up to about 250 -300 Hz, the large panels up to about 2000-3000 hz and the small ones for frequencies above that. Actual crossover frequencies and slopes yet to be determined. The crossover is a Beheringer DCX2496 and the amps will be two QSC PLX 2502's and one QSC RMX 1450. The hard part of this project is going to be the speaker frames, as they have to have a very high WAF before my better half lets them in the house.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th January 2012, 09:02 PM   #104
fperra is offline fperra  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lakewood, WA
Quote:
Originally Posted by JAMESBOS View Post
And somebody said it was easier and cheaper to build full range ESL's than FULL RANGE PLANARS!!?
I think it is. It just depends on how exotic you want to go.
  Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2012, 01:42 AM   #105
fperra is offline fperra  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lakewood, WA
Some more progress to report. All six panels have been rebuilt. The stators got three coats of polyester resin and this time I used 1" 3M tape fpr the spacing. I'm now running the bias at 8KV for the large panels and 4 KV for the small panels. I haven't checked to see how high I can run up the bias, but I'm sure there is much more in them. But no need to as they play plenty loud. I've also built a temporary frame to mount the panels for testing. I'll start tomorrow on that if I can figure out how to test??? In any case, listening to this one speaker in momo, it just sounds wonderful. Diana Krall Live in Paris is live in my shop. Here are some pictures:

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
  Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2012, 03:48 AM   #106
diyAudio Member
 
chinsettawong's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
That's very, very nice build. I like your car too.

Wachara C.
  Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2012, 04:51 AM   #107
diyAudio Member
 
rok-n-rol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinsettawong View Post
I like your car too.

Wachara C.
Car. What car?
  Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2012, 08:44 AM   #108
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Jackson,michigan
That Is Fantastic !!!

I did some quick frequency response measurments of my little panels today so maybe these can be of use to you.
These were done with no eq.

The Red plot is with the microphone (Peavey PVM520 TM) about 1 inch from the diagphram and the blue line is the signal.

The Green plot is with the microphone about 18 inches away and the black line is the signal.

I am still not quite familiar with HOLMImpulse and when I implemented Highpass I didn't notice the low frequency rolloff slope

The humps I believe are from reflections from many nearby flat surfaces off of my monitors and such.

I have found by using a digital VST crossover that I can set it as low as 240hz or 250hz without any coloration's or restrictions in vocals or instruments using Deep Purple's "lazy" as a sample running it full range (no eq ).
Below 240Hz the Diagphram resonance's start to color the sound.

The second Graph was done the other day and was EQ'ed to be flat with no dedicated crossover but biamped using the filters on my mixer as the crossover with a Sony 5.25" SS-MB150H speaker box using only the woofer and duct tape over the tweeter.

The plot of this setup is shown in Red and the woofer alone is in Green.

Both graphs were done without the VST crossover.

My panel being about the same width as yours seems to have a natural roll off around 600hz to 300hz (-3db at 400hz).
I don't have it setup to do extremely accurate measurements yet as these are just some quickies that I had done just to see where I am at.

I am currently working on my transformer situation at the moment.
I have been using any where from 5Kv to 10Kv as a bias voltage.
Today I hit 102db at 1 meter using my cheapy amp on single tones with out it shutting down
This is with a 1:256 transformation ratio, 8kv of bias and a 15Vp to 20Vp in to the transformer, I forgot to note the exact figure as this is when I decided to switch amps.
Tomorrow, I will use the DC300a and see what it does as it was getting late.

I am looking forward to see some more results of your build !!!


Keep on DIYing !!!



jer


P.S. I was using a 36db and 48db slope on the VST crossover test as this allowed me to not saturate the transformers with the frequency settings this low.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Small esl.jpg (248.1 KB, 173 views)
File Type: jpg With small woofer.jpg (256.6 KB, 43 views)

Last edited by geraldfryjr; 24th January 2012 at 09:02 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2012, 11:42 AM   #109
tyu is offline tyu  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Thanks for posting pic...looks great keep up the goooooooooooooood work.
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th January 2012, 09:52 PM   #110
fperra is offline fperra  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lakewood, WA
Default Measurements

I took some frequency response of the panels and they look pretty good to me, but I'm no expert in these matters, so your comments are appreciated.

The first graph is a measurement of the noise in the garage without driving the speakers and me being quiet.
Click the image to open in full size.

The second graph is the frequency response of the small panel alone.
Click the image to open in full size.

The third graph is the response of one of the large panels using four torroid transformers for step-up.
Click the image to open in full size.

The fourth graph is one of the large panels driven by two oil burner transformers in parallel/series.
Click the image to open in full size.

The last graph is all three panels with the large ones driven by the 4 toroids and one channel of the amp and the other amp channel driving the small panel.
Click the image to open in full size.

The frequemcy response of the oil burners sucks, but it does go a lot lower in the bass and they do swing more voltage.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Has anybody made an ELS headphone? chinsettawong Headphone Systems 450 4th February 2014 10:53 PM
ELS Construction Questions fperra Planars & Exotics 7 17th October 2011 01:01 AM
Metronome style design for multiple drivers, a number of design questions mountainhick Multi-Way 5 28th January 2010 03:31 AM
Curved ELS panels Johan_Ch Planars & Exotics 4 2nd November 2007 08:20 AM
Final 0.3 els systema Planars & Exotics 14 14th May 2006 04:10 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 03:32 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2