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Old 10th July 2003, 03:13 PM   #1
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Default Best 500Hz and down woofer for pairing with ESL?

Hi

I'm looking for suggestions for a 500Hz and down woofer that would lend itself for pairing with a homemade ESL.

Crossover will be active (Steve Bench Crossover on Gary Kaufman Circuit boards) (Maybe more info than you need ...but there you have it)

Earthquake inducing woofers are not the priority. Musicality and speed plus synergy with esl's are prio's.

My thinking was of woofers that are not at all known for gutwrenching bass but for neutrality Vifa P13WH 00-8.

ESL will be homebrew (Wire stator type) approx 100cm high 13cm wide powered by 4watt SE valve amp and woofer will be powered by Pioneer A-400 SS.

Budget : Around 100 Euro/Dollar per channel.

Woofers with cabinet plans are obviously preferred. (Proven designs as well) Can anyone point me to something like that?

TIA,
Bas
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Old 10th July 2003, 03:23 PM   #2
7V is offline 7V  United Kingdom
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Default Re: Best 500Hz and down woofer for pairing with ESL?

Quote:
Originally posted by Bas Horneman
I'm looking for suggestions for a 500Hz and down woofer that would lend itself for pairing with a homemade ESL.

Woofers with cabinet plans are obviously preferred. (Proven designs as well) Can anyone point me to something like that?
Well, the obvious way for you to go is with dipole subs a la Linkwitz.

The 'vanilla' version is probably outside your budget but if you can gel up on the theory I'm sure you could get something exceptional together.

Steve
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Old 10th July 2003, 03:52 PM   #3
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Hi Steve,

Saw the speakers you built! Loverly!

Mmm..good suggestion of yours...dipole subwoofers!!! ESL's are dipoles....so why not the woofers as well!

Good thinking!

That Linkwitz site is one of the worst in the business! I can't make heads or tails of it! Or am I the only one????

Cheers,
Bas
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Old 10th July 2003, 04:34 PM   #4
7V is offline 7V  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bas Horneman
Saw the speakers you built! Loverly!
Thanks. Someone's written a really nice review that I've just posted on my site as well: Review. Kind of makes life worth living, doesn't it?
Quote:
Mmm..good suggestion of yours...dipole subwoofers!!! ESL's are dipoles....so why not the woofers as well!
Well that's what I thought. In fact I would say that a dipole woofer is essential to get any kind of smooth transfer to your electrostatics at 500Hz.

Steve
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Old 10th July 2003, 07:14 PM   #5
Ken L is offline Ken L  United States
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Linkwitz dipoles only go up to 150 Hz.

And that is in the H configuration.

I was looking at them last night.

Later

Ken L
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Old 10th July 2003, 08:16 PM   #6
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This is the best woofer for low pass 500hz. It's a wide band driver
capable of much higher than 500hz while maintaining audiophile
sonics.

Excellent bass (10mm xmax), excellent midbass,
excellent midrange all in one package. I can't find
a woofer like this, and I've been looking for 2 years
now. I ordered eight Apollos.

http://www.lambdacoustics.com/drivers/TD15H.html

Faraday version is what you need for wideband
operation, not LE version.

Get em' before Nick decides to close his part time business
of building hand-made woofers.

If 15" is too big, I would use the 12" but no less.

If you expect to drive > 500 watts rms, then you should
consider Apollo version.
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Old 10th July 2003, 08:29 PM   #7
Ken L is offline Ken L  United States
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Ahhh -

Thylanter can always be counted to go to extremes if you're talking speakers- particularly when it comes to bass -

Life goes on, things change but refreshingly some things can be counted on to never change, and one of those things is that for Thylanter speakers mean _extreme machine_ .

I sure would love to hear your system someday Thylanter, where do you live?

Later

Ken L
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Old 10th July 2003, 10:10 PM   #8
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Extreme machines.

I can visualize two Lambda woofers in this box.

http://www.termpro.com/cgi-bin/ubb/u...;f=40;t=014209

This would make a nice system for when the
old lady invites friends over for a tea party.

Unveil the curtains..

roar!

/hehe


For extreme tweeters, this is the ticket for me.... eight of
these is the goal, four per channel, 109db sensitivity is
the target at 1 watt, flat down to 1.6khz.........

Makes you wonder why people buy Maggies with 87db
sensitivity ratings, 500w - 1000w just to get them to
sing.

http://home.pacbell.net/lordpk/speaker/photo.html

P.S. California is ground zero for the madness.
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Old 10th July 2003, 11:33 PM   #9
SY is offline SY  United States
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One big consideration is the shape of your ESLs; if they're line sources, you'll have a hellish time trying to get point-source woofers to match up. You'll need a woofer line source.

And I agree with Steve that you need to match dipoles to dipoles. I've got some terrific subwoofers that worked stunningly well in my point-source cones-in-a-box system, but stubbornly refuse to meld with my ESLs.
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Old 10th July 2003, 11:47 PM   #10
7V is offline 7V  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally posted by SY
One big consideration is the shape of your ESLs; if they're line sources, you'll have a hellish time trying to get point-source woofers to match up. You'll need a woofer line source.
I agree with Sy (is this a first, Sy?). So, we could be talking line source, dipole woofers that are well usable to beyond 500Hz. Bearing in mind the budget constraints, what about some of BAM's Parts Express buyout "NSB" 4" drivers or similar?

Steve
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