So ...

Borat · 23rd January 2010, 11:53 AM

So i have contemplated the question of whether the supposedly-inherent limitations of ESL technology can be overcome and determined that they can.

Now i have a choice - either i try to build it myself, or somebody helps me ?

If i have to build it myself i will need some practical information on how to build ESLs - a cookbook ? i think somebody gave me a link to a book, but i don't remember where it is ? Help ?

Or if anybody wants to build the prototype super-ESL with me - that would be even better. Any takers ? I can't tell you what it is unless you are serious about building it. I actually have two designs depending on how ambitious you are. One is only slightly more difficult than regular ESL to build - and solves most of the problems. Another very complex to build but solves all problems.

mavric · 23rd January 2010, 12:19 PM

we are all in the same boat here, what are your suggestions? I have posted my own, just to find out that every idea comes with a problem.
tried and tru is what i have been looking for, doing a test today on a theory, i wish you explain a little more information on your project, this stuff is not cheap, that is why i posted an alternate material. with that said, quote"I am shooting in the dark" maybe i will find my target. all i am trying to do is coat the panels, with something i have readily availabe, will know this afternoon.

Borat · 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mavric

we are all in the same boat here ... tried and tru is what i have been looking for

i specifically want to build a revolutionary product which i have invented.

can you explain what you mean by us being in the same boat ?

i have a hard time understanding the meaning of your post.

when i say i need a cookbook i don't mean that i will actually build a sample design. i mean i will take hints on construction methods and adopt them to my significantly different design.

Capaciti · 23rd January 2010, 01:49 PM

Hi Borat,

Ok, here i am !

I offer you my over 20 years experience in building ESL. If you tell me what to build i will do it (as long its really something outperforming).

If you like to contact me: info@capaciti.de

Capaciti

Liquisonic · 07:12 PM

Hey Borat, I don't know for sure if this is the book someone else recommended, but I'm fairly sure it would be
BKAA20 - Electrostatic Loudspeaker Design Cookbook

And if anyone reads this and knows of a better book, please post, as (some) of the materials/methods are outdated.

Thanks, Steve

Andrew Eckhardt · 23rd January 2010, 07:38 PM

I always wondered about seriously pushing the dynamic limits of ESLs. Running large stator gaps and high voltages, using direct drive amplfier arrays with some kind of inverse square compensation for more linear high level LF drive.

Borat · 24th January 2010, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capaciti

Hi Borat,

Ok, here i am !

I offer you my over 20 years experience in building ESL. If you tell me what to build i will do it (as long its really something outperforming).

If you like to contact me: info@capaciti.de

Capaciti

OK we will talk about it.

Cal Weldon · 25th January 2010, 03:41 AM

Mavric,

I have deleted some of your posts. Please make your point clear. You are confusing the issue and not really helping.

rok-n-rol · 25th January 2010, 12:25 PM

Hi Andrew, I'm interested but any discussion should probably be done over in one of the older treads where the subject has been addressed. I wouldn't hold your breath for anyone to break out their new project in the works though. I would like to see the HV linear problem become more of a non-issue . A fairly new commercial OTL amp was mentioned awhile back, their site showed a second amp to be released with enough voltage to drive a 2.5mm stator to diaprahm spacing. Controlled and monitored with interface. I didn't e-mail them to ask if I should look forward to a review or even better, a dealer here in the US. Has anyone heard them in action or has Sound-Lab found the magic amp for their VHV stats and is ramping up production to truly be the King. Ha Ha

Borat · 26th January 2010, 01:09 AM

To Michael ( Capacity ):

The speaker that needs to be built essentially involves a panel which is unevenly energized. It will be energized fully at the center and partially at the edges.

The difference between the way the center of the panel and edges of the panel are energized will be in level only. There will not be any dedicated low-pass filtering for the edges and there will not be any time delay networks ( as in QUAD ESLs ).

Did you, perhaps, have something like this in mind yourself ?

Or would you consider this taking it in a new direction for you ?

23rd January 2010, 11:53 AM	#1
Borat Banned Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Silicon Valley & NYC	So ... So i have contemplated the question of whether the supposedly-inherent limitations of ESL technology can be overcome and determined that they can. Now i have a choice - either i try to build it myself, or somebody helps me ? If i have to build it myself i will need some practical information on how to build ESLs - a cookbook ? i think somebody gave me a link to a book, but i don't remember where it is ? Help ? Or if anybody wants to build the prototype super-ESL with me - that would be even better. Any takers ? I can't tell you what it is unless you are serious about building it. I actually have two designs depending on how ambitious you are. One is only slightly more difficult than regular ESL to build - and solves most of the problems. Another very complex to build but solves all problems.

23rd January 2010, 12:19 PM	#2
mavric diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: some place nice	we are all in the same boat here, what are your suggestions? I have posted my own, just to find out that every idea comes with a problem. tried and tru is what i have been looking for, doing a test today on a theory, i wish you explain a little more information on your project, this stuff is not cheap, that is why i posted an alternate material. with that said, quote"I am shooting in the dark" maybe i will find my target. all i am trying to do is coat the panels, with something i have readily availabe, will know this afternoon. __________________ The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing. A wise man does not need advice and a fool won't take it.

23rd January 2010, 07:05 PM	#5
Liquisonic diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Great Lakes Bay Region, MI	ESL Cookbook Hey Borat, I don't know for sure if this is the book someone else recommended, but I'm fairly sure it would be BKAA20 - Electrostatic Loudspeaker Design Cookbook And if anyone reads this and knows of a better book, please post, as (some) of the materials/methods are outdated. Thanks, Steve Last edited by Liquisonic; 23rd January 2010 at 07:12 PM.

25th January 2010, 03:41 AM	#8
Cal Weldon Speakerholic diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: British Columbia	Mavric, I have deleted some of your posts. Please make your point clear. You are confusing the issue and not really helping. __________________ Next stop: Margaritaville Some of Cal's stuff \| Cal Weldon Consulting

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23rd January 2010, 01:49 PM	#4
Capaciti diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Southern Germany	Hi Borat, Ok, here i am ! I offer you my over 20 years experience in building ESL. If you tell me what to build i will do it (as long its really something outperforming). If you like to contact me: info@capaciti.de Capaciti

23rd January 2010, 07:38 PM	#6
Andrew Eckhardt diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: PA	I always wondered about seriously pushing the dynamic limits of ESLs. Running large stator gaps and high voltages, using direct drive amplfier arrays with some kind of inverse square compensation for more linear high level LF drive.

25th January 2010, 12:25 PM	#9
rok-n-rol diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Ia.	Hi Andrew, I'm interested but any discussion should probably be done over in one of the older treads where the subject has been addressed. I wouldn't hold your breath for anyone to break out their new project in the works though. I would like to see the HV linear problem become more of a non-issue . A fairly new commercial OTL amp was mentioned awhile back, their site showed a second amp to be released with enough voltage to drive a 2.5mm stator to diaprahm spacing. Controlled and monitored with interface. I didn't e-mail them to ask if I should look forward to a review or even better, a dealer here in the US. Has anyone heard them in action or has Sound-Lab found the magic amp for their VHV stats and is ramping up production to truly be the King. Ha Ha

26th January 2010, 01:09 AM	#10
Borat Banned Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Silicon Valley & NYC	To Michael ( Capacity ): The speaker that needs to be built essentially involves a panel which is unevenly energized. It will be energized fully at the center and partially at the edges. The difference between the way the center of the panel and edges of the panel are energized will be in level only. There will not be any dedicated low-pass filtering for the edges and there will not be any time delay networks ( as in QUAD ESLs ). Did you, perhaps, have something like this in mind yourself ? Or would you consider this taking it in a new direction for you ?

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