I'm trying to think of ways to make an ESL speaker with as little effort as possible with EASY to get parts, but not in such a way that the quality of the final product will be comprimised.
So far I have come up with
Some kind of pre-made welded mesh for the stators (A good idea it seems but I'm having trouble finding anything suitable in any online shops, but there must be something out there!)
Easy to get 6 micron Hostaphan from eBay (There is a supplier of this there) I have also found a place to order Mylar as thin as 2 micron..
Spacers can be cheap acrylic strips easily glued into the right shape
Copper tape from eBay to connect the diagphragm
Getting a hold of a bias supply is seemingly the easiest part of DIY ESL construction, this is not a problem
Step up transformers can be 6v toroidals or valve output transformers (the latter being slightly harder to get). As I intend to only run the panels I make down to around 2-400Hz this isn't too tricky, but others might attempt to run them lower so a suitable transformer might be tricky to get.
I want to make some ESLs so badly! But getting the right parts is tricky.
So far I have come up with
Some kind of pre-made welded mesh for the stators (A good idea it seems but I'm having trouble finding anything suitable in any online shops, but there must be something out there!)
Easy to get 6 micron Hostaphan from eBay (There is a supplier of this there) I have also found a place to order Mylar as thin as 2 micron..
Spacers can be cheap acrylic strips easily glued into the right shape
Copper tape from eBay to connect the diagphragm
Getting a hold of a bias supply is seemingly the easiest part of DIY ESL construction, this is not a problem
Step up transformers can be 6v toroidals or valve output transformers (the latter being slightly harder to get). As I intend to only run the panels I make down to around 2-400Hz this isn't too tricky, but others might attempt to run them lower so a suitable transformer might be tricky to get.
I want to make some ESLs so badly! But getting the right parts is tricky.
Some ideas for making it even easier:
Instead of using acrylic strips for the spacers, use 3M foam tape. Lots of us have used it and it's holding up very well. Martin Logan uses some sort of urethane foam tape as well. In addition to the ease of building (assuming you get it lined up the first time), the spongy nature of the stuff makes the panels fairly dead, so resonances and rattles aren't as much of an issue as a hard spacer.
I see you are on the other side of the water, but over here, we have mcmaster carr which offers a wide range of perforated metal. And even better is a product from parts express. I just found it the other night, and it's HUGE:
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=262-878
Pre-powder coated steel flat grill material in three different hole sizes and styles (all worthy of making ESL's with). 22" x 30". A pair of them costs like $40.
I'd use either two or 4 pairs of them and use them either sliced in half or full size to make either a 44" x 15" set of panels or a 22" x 60" set of panels.
The last thing you need to worry about with the panels is the diaphragm coating. I'd recommend the coating from ER audio.
You'll still want an active crossover for best results. Something that can handle a shelving filter as well as the normal highpass lowpass aspects.
Sheldon
Instead of using acrylic strips for the spacers, use 3M foam tape. Lots of us have used it and it's holding up very well. Martin Logan uses some sort of urethane foam tape as well. In addition to the ease of building (assuming you get it lined up the first time), the spongy nature of the stuff makes the panels fairly dead, so resonances and rattles aren't as much of an issue as a hard spacer.
I see you are on the other side of the water, but over here, we have mcmaster carr which offers a wide range of perforated metal. And even better is a product from parts express. I just found it the other night, and it's HUGE:
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=262-878
Pre-powder coated steel flat grill material in three different hole sizes and styles (all worthy of making ESL's with). 22" x 30". A pair of them costs like $40.
I'd use either two or 4 pairs of them and use them either sliced in half or full size to make either a 44" x 15" set of panels or a 22" x 60" set of panels.
The last thing you need to worry about with the panels is the diaphragm coating. I'd recommend the coating from ER audio.
You'll still want an active crossover for best results. Something that can handle a shelving filter as well as the normal highpass lowpass aspects.
Sheldon
stokesdd,
Thankyou for your reply.
The use of foam tape for spacers is an excellent idea and I will use it. It also means panels can be dismantled, which is a plus (Hopefully some kind of solvent can make them come off without resorting to tearing it off running the risk of bending the stator)
Those pre-coated metal sheets look good as well, the problem I have with them however is that I will have to cut them, which doing neatly is quite difficult. I don't have much experience with making things so I'd like this to be as simple as possible
Thanks again for your suggestions
Thankyou for your reply.
The use of foam tape for spacers is an excellent idea and I will use it. It also means panels can be dismantled, which is a plus (Hopefully some kind of solvent can make them come off without resorting to tearing it off running the risk of bending the stator)
Those pre-coated metal sheets look good as well, the problem I have with them however is that I will have to cut them, which doing neatly is quite difficult. I don't have much experience with making things so I'd like this to be as simple as possible
Thanks again for your suggestions
Those 3M foam tapes are insanely ugly to remove. They can be removed, but expect to work at it.
If you don't want to cut, you could build a 22" x 60" ESL, which is a great size for a panel. I use 20" x 48" set and it's a good size.
You can also cut them with a jigsaw if you are careful and if you build a frame to hold them, you'll never see your cut. If you look at the following picture, you'll see I took 1" x 2" poplar frame (this was a prototype in the pic) and dado'ed out a groove that the panel fits into. If your jigsaw cut is a bit ratty, it would be hidden at the bottom of the dado.
http://quadesl.com/speaker/diyesl/stator_closeup.jpg
Sheldon
If you don't want to cut, you could build a 22" x 60" ESL, which is a great size for a panel. I use 20" x 48" set and it's a good size.
You can also cut them with a jigsaw if you are careful and if you build a frame to hold them, you'll never see your cut. If you look at the following picture, you'll see I took 1" x 2" poplar frame (this was a prototype in the pic) and dado'ed out a groove that the panel fits into. If your jigsaw cut is a bit ratty, it would be hidden at the bottom of the dado.
http://quadesl.com/speaker/diyesl/stator_closeup.jpg
Sheldon
Paul Ranson said:
http://www.modelresearchlabs.com/pricelist.htm
Don't buy it all up! I might want some too!
look here...
http://eslrepair.com/default.aspx
you can purchase nylon powder coated stators in flat and curved profiles. You can also buy nes Acoustat transformers here too.
http://eslrepair.com/default.aspx
you can purchase nylon powder coated stators in flat and curved profiles. You can also buy nes Acoustat transformers here too.
Hi,
"I don´t want to take any effort in the project....It mustn´t cost a dime......It has to be of course the best!!"
Do You guys sometimes really realize what You are talking??
Well..the material cost is usually low for ESLs, but to get best results You will have to put a certain effort and time into the project. If You don´t want that..simply forget it..it´ll be wasted money and time, unless You buy a commercial ESL.
It should be no problem to get all the needed parts nowadays. There are enough sources to be found inthis forum already.
It´s much harder to come up with a good overall concept.
Just putting part A and part B together with glue C won´t end up with a good ESL-panel. Working this way means to just get some experiences (learning by doing and by doing failures) with this kind of matter, but not to succeed.
The stator sheets from partsexpress eg. will make no good ESL-Stator (too large holes, very probabely too thin coating, what coating material anyway?)....it´ll work somehow, but imho thats rather wasted money. The offer of ESL-repair sounds much better. Do they really use Nylon-powders? It´d be interesting what hole pattern they offer and if the metal sheets were electropolished before coating (probabely not, considering the low prices).
You have to decide, between more cost/lower effort (metal sheet/tape spacers) and lower cost/more effort (wire stators/hard spacers).
You have to decide where and how to linearize the panel´s freq-response (before the tranny within the crossover-circuit using sheet metal stators) or within the panel itself (using electrical segmentation with resistors/inductances and wire stators).
Since linearization is needed for every panel (!) You really should waste a thought or two on this point in advance.
You have to decide wether You want a panel for a hybrid ESL or a Fullranger. I suggest to start with a hybrid, since the problems rise significantely the lower You are going in freqency.
When You really badly want to build a good ESL, start first with evaluating good working concepts and get Yourself Infos about what an ESLs is and how it works. To get the right materials is then a minor problem in a later stage of the project!
jauu
Calvin
"I don´t want to take any effort in the project....It mustn´t cost a dime......It has to be of course the best!!"
Do You guys sometimes really realize what You are talking??
Well..the material cost is usually low for ESLs, but to get best results You will have to put a certain effort and time into the project. If You don´t want that..simply forget it..it´ll be wasted money and time, unless You buy a commercial ESL.
It should be no problem to get all the needed parts nowadays. There are enough sources to be found inthis forum already.
It´s much harder to come up with a good overall concept.
Just putting part A and part B together with glue C won´t end up with a good ESL-panel. Working this way means to just get some experiences (learning by doing and by doing failures) with this kind of matter, but not to succeed.
The stator sheets from partsexpress eg. will make no good ESL-Stator (too large holes, very probabely too thin coating, what coating material anyway?)....it´ll work somehow, but imho thats rather wasted money. The offer of ESL-repair sounds much better. Do they really use Nylon-powders? It´d be interesting what hole pattern they offer and if the metal sheets were electropolished before coating (probabely not, considering the low prices).
You have to decide, between more cost/lower effort (metal sheet/tape spacers) and lower cost/more effort (wire stators/hard spacers).
You have to decide where and how to linearize the panel´s freq-response (before the tranny within the crossover-circuit using sheet metal stators) or within the panel itself (using electrical segmentation with resistors/inductances and wire stators).
Since linearization is needed for every panel (!) You really should waste a thought or two on this point in advance.
You have to decide wether You want a panel for a hybrid ESL or a Fullranger. I suggest to start with a hybrid, since the problems rise significantely the lower You are going in freqency.
When You really badly want to build a good ESL, start first with evaluating good working concepts and get Yourself Infos about what an ESLs is and how it works. To get the right materials is then a minor problem in a later stage of the project!
jauu
Calvin
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