Hello
I am surprised not to find here a thread on a planar for infra.
This is a true question because planar do not have good solution to be completed for down register in a dipole mode...
A french have built a special planar for infra, to complete his Magneplanar, of which he is a true lover. He simply named it "Infraplanar".
The adress : http://infraplanar.free.fr/
Anybody to have heard of it ? Or listened it ?
I am surprised not to find here a thread on a planar for infra.
This is a true question because planar do not have good solution to be completed for down register in a dipole mode...
A french have built a special planar for infra, to complete his Magneplanar, of which he is a true lover. He simply named it "Infraplanar".
The adress : http://infraplanar.free.fr/
Anybody to have heard of it ? Or listened it ?
Last edited:
Hello Sreten,
Listened not in an anechoïd room nor in open space, this infra panels work very well as down as 10 Hz, as shown by the published response curve, and as proved by several music listenings with a lot of systems completed by Infraplanar.
Tests made by Hifi magazines or web sites (Six Moons) confirm that this is a very efficient solution, specially in complement of planar main system.
When my ears destroy the bad pronostics of theory, I believe my ears.
What is the jugement of yours ? Did you ever listen to them ?
Rgds, Tiburce.
Hi henry,
That's true, quality as a weight, and a price...
But for those who run after 20 Hz performance by the way of "traditionnal" 46 cm, or best, like 76 cm... in heavy cabinets of thick wood, brassed with iron or other hard wood, isolated from bad vibrations by thick covers of tar or even lead, when no doubled walls with sand inside... that's a weight, too.
And I don't speak of those who build their infra system in the walls of their house : they even can no longer move their infra components !
I find that Infraplnar is a well better solution : that can be pushed easy on the ground of your living room - if not your home music room - to get somme more place for family visits, and with its overall thickness of less 10 centimeters, it can disappear almost completely.
I finish with the price. For this level of quality, it's not a lost charge but an investment because of the long time you are willing to keep it, as soon as you listen to.
That's true, quality as a weight, and a price...
But for those who run after 20 Hz performance by the way of "traditionnal" 46 cm, or best, like 76 cm... in heavy cabinets of thick wood, brassed with iron or other hard wood, isolated from bad vibrations by thick covers of tar or even lead, when no doubled walls with sand inside... that's a weight, too.
And I don't speak of those who build their infra system in the walls of their house : they even can no longer move their infra components !
I find that Infraplnar is a well better solution : that can be pushed easy on the ground of your living room - if not your home music room - to get somme more place for family visits, and with its overall thickness of less 10 centimeters, it can disappear almost completely.
I finish with the price. For this level of quality, it's not a lost charge but an investment because of the long time you are willing to keep it, as soon as you listen to.
Hi,
That is up to you, though I suspect you haven't explored the
prognostics of the theory regarding the reproduction of 10Hz.
Required SPL for 10Hz to hit the threshold of audibility, nevermind
be usefully audible. The baffle loss for 30m wavelengths etc, any
OB afficiando knows the lower you want to go the less it works.
I'm not going to go there, practical design that works needs
theory that works, and conversely to you I don't take one
iota of notice of listening tests that claim the impossible,
or a least imply fundamental limitations do not exist.
Bass extension without the required SPL is near pointless.
rgds, sreten.
Hi,
I'm not a scientific but i know that what you describe is relative to open space measures of hp, so that reflected waves cannot go back to polluate the results.
The in-room listening has nothing to deal with open air measures. In a room, there is plenty of reflected waves that you cannot completely kill, - even by room-treatments, - even in putting the hp in a close box, because the reflected inside sounds go outside through the membrane of your hp.
In a room, the cancellation of dipoles hp is tremendously lowered. But the theory cannot set up exact formulation of this lowering, because all situations depend on the dimensions of the room. And if the idea of a normalised room could be accepted to find the equations, they could not be be applicable in a not normalised room.
The adaptation of a hp system to a specific room to get a good sound holds on being made by experience and hearing, instead of application of scientific formulas.
Scientific specialists prefer to repeat that cancellation make dipole hp not work.
Too easy !
They did not know it was impossible, they made it...
I'm not a scientific but i know that what you describe is relative to open space measures of hp, so that reflected waves cannot go back to polluate the results.
The in-room listening has nothing to deal with open air measures. In a room, there is plenty of reflected waves that you cannot completely kill, - even by room-treatments, - even in putting the hp in a close box, because the reflected inside sounds go outside through the membrane of your hp.
In a room, the cancellation of dipoles hp is tremendously lowered. But the theory cannot set up exact formulation of this lowering, because all situations depend on the dimensions of the room. And if the idea of a normalised room could be accepted to find the equations, they could not be be applicable in a not normalised room.
The adaptation of a hp system to a specific room to get a good sound holds on being made by experience and hearing, instead of application of scientific formulas.
Scientific specialists prefer to repeat that cancellation make dipole hp not work.
Too easy !
They did not know it was impossible, they made it...
Hi,
To be more precise, we must know that cancellation does not appear in every point of the space around the dipole. It appears only when front and rear waves meet, having made exactly the same distance, that is to say where we commonly install baffles. Elsewhere, cancellation doesnot appear so strong and decreases rapidly. Specially in front of the dipole, there cannot be cancelletion because the distance between front and rear surface of the membrane is maximum : rear vibration cannot reach front one. Too much advance.
So,the phenomenon is not so important when you consider the whole space around the dipole in open air.
In a listening room, because of wall reflexion, there is a general mix that nobody can describe and thus, measure or predict... Every where, there is points of pression and points of depression. Be carefull to where you put your microphone to measure ! 10 cm aside, you get a completely different result. This is why positionning HP in a music room is a question of listening and expertise by experimented installators, not scientifics professors.
To be more precise, we must know that cancellation does not appear in every point of the space around the dipole. It appears only when front and rear waves meet, having made exactly the same distance, that is to say where we commonly install baffles. Elsewhere, cancellation doesnot appear so strong and decreases rapidly. Specially in front of the dipole, there cannot be cancelletion because the distance between front and rear surface of the membrane is maximum : rear vibration cannot reach front one. Too much advance.
So,the phenomenon is not so important when you consider the whole space around the dipole in open air.
In a listening room, because of wall reflexion, there is a general mix that nobody can describe and thus, measure or predict... Every where, there is points of pression and points of depression. Be carefull to where you put your microphone to measure ! 10 cm aside, you get a completely different result. This is why positionning HP in a music room is a question of listening and expertise by experimented installators, not scientifics professors.
You can see the response curve published on the Infraplanar website.
The only thing i can say is : this roll off does not appear.
You can read the following affirmation , as I do :
"Courbe de réponse en proximité, hors influence du local, micro à 3 cm de la membrane ;
mesures faites avec STEPS (ARTA) + carte son Edirol UA 25 EX + micro Audiomatica MIC-01 : On voit que la linéarité est très bonne et très étendue dans le grave. Avec des niveaux de puissance efficace de l’ordre de 5 Watts seulement, les niveaux sonores atteints sont très impressionnants et génèrent une écoute tout à fait réaliste."
.... "You will have a 6db roll off starting at 266 hz". Sorry, we don't have....
True. See adress infraplanar
You can see in the chapter : EFFICACITE a curve taken in open space, the micro in axe at one meter.
Where is the roll-off from 266 Hz to 10 Hz ?
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.