My attempt to make a fullrange ESL
For two years now I have been listening to my ESL-hybrid speakeras, and I'm very pleased - but time has come for a new build.
This time I'll have a go at a fullrange ESL-speaker and the plans at the moment are:
- 1500x250mm bass-panel, d/s 3mm
- 1500x250mm treble/tweeter-panel, d/s 1.5-2mm
Stators made off 1mm steelplate, 3mm holes 4mm spacing => 51% open area before powdercoating.
Stators prepared and awaiting paint.
(also shows my "extra" 1000x250mm stators that I made from the "scrap" when cutting)
Closeup off how I make the connectionpoints to the stators.
3mm brass screw and nut, grind it down so it's in level with the plate before painting.
On the "nut side" I grind the screw and solder it to the nut and solderlug.
/R
CharlieM: It sure does! It might get better with time, but I doubt it!
I got my stators back from the paint shop today!
I have begun to tape two off the stators using 1.5x20mm tape I found at a local supermarket. The tape is quite stiff, wich I think is good for my two layers to get 3mm d/s.
I have a testroll off 3M tape made for powdercoated stuff (acording to the 3M rep.) and I think the glue on my noname tape is just as good as the 3M stuff.
Just in case, I sanded the edges using 180grit paper and cleaned with acetone before ataching the tape to the stators.
The problem now, is that I have to find a solution for my vertical segmentation off the panel as this will be visible when the panel is mounted in its frame.
/R
I got my stators back from the paint shop today!
I have begun to tape two off the stators using 1.5x20mm tape I found at a local supermarket. The tape is quite stiff, wich I think is good for my two layers to get 3mm d/s.
I have a testroll off 3M tape made for powdercoated stuff (acording to the 3M rep.) and I think the glue on my noname tape is just as good as the 3M stuff.
Just in case, I sanded the edges using 180grit paper and cleaned with acetone before ataching the tape to the stators.
The problem now, is that I have to find a solution for my vertical segmentation off the panel as this will be visible when the panel is mounted in its frame.
/R
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Hi SM7UYJ,
Your stators look really nice. Personally, I have found out that running ESL full range isn't that difficult at all. The most important issue is finding the right transformers. Which kind of transformers will you be using? What will be the step up ratio of the transformers?
Please keep us posted and good luck with your build.
Wachara C.
Your stators look really nice. Personally, I have found out that running ESL full range isn't that difficult at all. The most important issue is finding the right transformers. Which kind of transformers will you be using? What will be the step up ratio of the transformers?
Please keep us posted and good luck with your build.
Wachara C.
Hi Wachara,
I have a bunch off 2x12V/2x115V/80VA toroids that I plan to use.
In my hybrids I use 2x5V/240V/80VA (primary winding redone from 27V), but when I tested the frequencyresponce, the new 12V (original winding) measured much better in the lower end!
With the larger d/s I hope I can get away with four off the transformers in original, but likely I'll have to rewind them for a larger transformation ratio.
I will start experimenting when I have my first panel ready!
/R
I have a bunch off 2x12V/2x115V/80VA toroids that I plan to use.
In my hybrids I use 2x5V/240V/80VA (primary winding redone from 27V), but when I tested the frequencyresponce, the new 12V (original winding) measured much better in the lower end!
With the larger d/s I hope I can get away with four off the transformers in original, but likely I'll have to rewind them for a larger transformation ratio.
I will start experimenting when I have my first panel ready!
/R
Hi SM7UYJ,
I sure like to know how the toroids perform. I've also tested many transformers, and I'm now quite happy with my custom wound, humongous, 50mmx50mm EI transformers. My step up ratio is around 1:90. My spacer thickness is 2 mm and the panel size is 25CMx120CM. I am running my ESL full range. The bass is not heart pounding but I'm very satisfied.
Wachara C.
I sure like to know how the toroids perform. I've also tested many transformers, and I'm now quite happy with my custom wound, humongous, 50mmx50mm EI transformers. My step up ratio is around 1:90. My spacer thickness is 2 mm and the panel size is 25CMx120CM. I am running my ESL full range. The bass is not heart pounding but I'm very satisfied.
Wachara C.
Here is a closup off the stator - "outside" with the sharp egdes!
Coating used is the same as last time, some sort off PETpaint - black!
If I get any problems, I'll have them put on second round off paint.
It's my day off, so I went to the lumberyard to buy material for the frames.
Dimensions will be 1780 x 710mm with a 250mm "wing" on the backside to stiffen things up and hopefully help the bass a bit!
/R
Coating used is the same as last time, some sort off PETpaint - black!
If I get any problems, I'll have them put on second round off paint.
It's my day off, so I went to the lumberyard to buy material for the frames.
Dimensions will be 1780 x 710mm with a 250mm "wing" on the backside to stiffen things up and hopefully help the bass a bit!
/R
The plan is to use a active cross over and add compensation as needed.
I have not started experimenting as I want to mount the panels in their fames first.
If the voulme is very high I can get the film to hit the stators, so I think I'll re do the panel using 1mm + 1.5mm +1mm tape for a total d/s off 3.5mm.
My 1mm tape has a very good glue that sticks well to both stators and Mylar, the glue on my 1.5mm tape is not as good but the tape is much stiffer , so I taught I'll combine them.
/R
I have not started experimenting as I want to mount the panels in their fames first.
If the voulme is very high I can get the film to hit the stators, so I think I'll re do the panel using 1mm + 1.5mm +1mm tape for a total d/s off 3.5mm.
My 1mm tape has a very good glue that sticks well to both stators and Mylar, the glue on my 1.5mm tape is not as good but the tape is much stiffer , so I taught I'll combine them.
/R
The stators are now taped with 3.5mm doublesided tape, but I'm not sure how I should segment the diaphragm
The basspanel, without segmentation, is 210 x 1460mm.
Should I run a 10mm vertical strip down the middle resulting in two 100x1460mm segments or should I divide it using horisontal strips spaced say 150 to 400mm apart?
The current testpanel is spaced horisontaly with abt. 400, 500 & 600mm "high" segments.
/R
The basspanel, without segmentation, is 210 x 1460mm.
Should I run a 10mm vertical strip down the middle resulting in two 100x1460mm segments or should I divide it using horisontal strips spaced say 150 to 400mm apart?
The current testpanel is spaced horisontaly with abt. 400, 500 & 600mm "high" segments.
/R
Hi Wachara,
Thank you for your reply!
I need the spacers for stability as the 1mm sheet metal I use for the stators gets a bit flimsy without (I'm not using any support from the frame other than the mounting slots)
I have tried using silicone dots before but the d/s off the panel got uneven, a problem I have not had with tape strips used after that.
When testing my recent panel (with 3mm d/s) my 3kV EHT and 1:80 transformer did a decent job, so I hope abt. 5kV and 1:150 in the final version will be enough!
/Roger
Thank you for your reply!
I need the spacers for stability as the 1mm sheet metal I use for the stators gets a bit flimsy without (I'm not using any support from the frame other than the mounting slots)
I have tried using silicone dots before but the d/s off the panel got uneven, a problem I have not had with tape strips used after that.
When testing my recent panel (with 3mm d/s) my 3kV EHT and 1:80 transformer did a decent job, so I hope abt. 5kV and 1:150 in the final version will be enough!
/Roger
Trying new spacers!
Not confident that my 3-3.5mm tape would stand for the tension needed in my bass panels and that it would flex to much and cause the film to hit the stators, I started to look for other solutions..
I went to the local hardware store to se what they had in stock sutiable for use as spacers. To my suprise I found that they had perfect 30x20x3 mm L shaped black PVC in 1 and 2m lengths!
Not the sheapest alternative at 3 Euro/m, but alot easier then ordering plastic from a suplyer and having it cut in strips + I get the benefit off the "L"-shape in that it "grips" the edge off the stators and isolates the edges better.
After swearing quite alot in the garage I managed to get them in shape by:
1. Cutting down one end off the "L" (to abt 4-5mm) using my circle saw with guide, PVC placed on the "edge" off a pice off MDF.
2. Using the wise in my small mill as a guide and "sliding the PVC trough I milled down the flange to abt. 1mm, the thicknes off my stotors.
After sanding the edges and cleaning everything off with aceton, it looked like this:
Glued to the stators using black "boatglue". (used on boats to glue wood, metall etc. - said to glue and cure under water)
/R
Not confident that my 3-3.5mm tape would stand for the tension needed in my bass panels and that it would flex to much and cause the film to hit the stators, I started to look for other solutions..
I went to the local hardware store to se what they had in stock sutiable for use as spacers. To my suprise I found that they had perfect 30x20x3 mm L shaped black PVC in 1 and 2m lengths!
Not the sheapest alternative at 3 Euro/m, but alot easier then ordering plastic from a suplyer and having it cut in strips + I get the benefit off the "L"-shape in that it "grips" the edge off the stators and isolates the edges better.
After swearing quite alot in the garage I managed to get them in shape by:
1. Cutting down one end off the "L" (to abt 4-5mm) using my circle saw with guide, PVC placed on the "edge" off a pice off MDF.
2. Using the wise in my small mill as a guide and "sliding the PVC trough I milled down the flange to abt. 1mm, the thicknes off my stotors.
After sanding the edges and cleaning everything off with aceton, it looked like this:
Glued to the stators using black "boatglue". (used on boats to glue wood, metall etc. - said to glue and cure under water)
/R
Hi Wachara,
I dont know what the PVC is used for actualy, but I suspect as corner protection, mounting brackets ?
The store had them in white and black PVC and also in anodized aluminum.
I'm not sure about the glue yet, perhaps I'll use thin doublesided tape.
I've done some tests using Tesas super strong thin doublesided tape, but the glue is to thick and causes the film to flex.
Tests with a thin tape from a local car supply shop has gone much better. The 12µm film used in the tests tore before I could se any movement.
I think the thin doublesided tape is a good solution as it acts as a "flexible" glue around the charge ring and also makes life a bit easier if I have to take the panel apart to replace diaphragm etc. - and it's fast!
(the glue for the spacers take abt. 12h to cure, so I have to make up for lost time some how!)
/Roger
I dont know what the PVC is used for actualy, but I suspect as corner protection, mounting brackets ?
The store had them in white and black PVC and also in anodized aluminum.
I'm not sure about the glue yet, perhaps I'll use thin doublesided tape.
I've done some tests using Tesas super strong thin doublesided tape, but the glue is to thick and causes the film to flex.
Tests with a thin tape from a local car supply shop has gone much better. The 12µm film used in the tests tore before I could se any movement.
I think the thin doublesided tape is a good solution as it acts as a "flexible" glue around the charge ring and also makes life a bit easier if I have to take the panel apart to replace diaphragm etc. - and it's fast!
(the glue for the spacers take abt. 12h to cure, so I have to make up for lost time some how!)
/Roger
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