hi,
1- after long time and age, about 20 years of using it, the membranes are touching the stators and cause arches. by coating i think this problem can be eliminated, it will be like the acoustat that has isolated wires as stators.
2- after long time and age, the glue that holds the stators on the frame is loosing strength so the stators become loose. in this case i have to disassembly the 4 units of each speaker to parts and re glue the stators and performing a total renewing to the speakers. so i was thinking to improve the isolation and coat it.
3- what do you think can improve the life of it?
Best regards
Williams
1- after long time and age, about 20 years of using it, the membranes are touching the stators and cause arches. by coating i think this problem can be eliminated, it will be like the acoustat that has isolated wires as stators.
2- after long time and age, the glue that holds the stators on the frame is loosing strength so the stators become loose. in this case i have to disassembly the 4 units of each speaker to parts and re glue the stators and performing a total renewing to the speakers. so i was thinking to improve the isolation and coat it.
3- what do you think can improve the life of it?
Best regards
Williams
Williams Audio said:
Hi Williams
I would say that 20 years between maintenance is not a bad period, do you really need to lengthen it?
In regard to the membrane touching the stators......If I understand your post correctly then you are trying to circumvent the problem. Personally, I would cure the problem, and replace/rehang the membrane and do a complete rebuild. Then enjoy good music and no sleepless nights for the next 20 years..
just my opinion, but there is also the chance that I have misunderstood the post.
Ed
This is a common failure mode of the ESL63, stators getting loose form the plastic louvre. The solution is, like you mentioned, to glue them back. You can do this without replacing the diaphragms.
If the stators are in place and the diaphragm is not torn, there should be no arcing. So a coating would not be necessary. And if the stators are loose and touching the diaphragm, a little coating won't help. It just has to be repaired as soon as possible!
The diaphragms will probably have some damage caused by the arcing. If they are not torn you might get away with a careful wipe-off with a soft (damp) cloth.
If the diaphragms do have to be replaced, then you are probably best off with an expert. I know smart and very capable guys who have spend years to get this part right, so I would not do that yourself, unless you're willing to accept less than top notch performance (or go the long and costly road of becoming an expert yourself.
If the stators are in place and the diaphragm is not torn, there should be no arcing. So a coating would not be necessary. And if the stators are loose and touching the diaphragm, a little coating won't help. It just has to be repaired as soon as possible!
The diaphragms will probably have some damage caused by the arcing. If they are not torn you might get away with a careful wipe-off with a soft (damp) cloth.
If the diaphragms do have to be replaced, then you are probably best off with an expert. I know smart and very capable guys who have spend years to get this part right, so I would not do that yourself, unless you're willing to accept less than top notch performance (or go the long and costly road of becoming an expert yourself
.hi,
my big question is why 'quad company' in there good years didn't coat the stators?
this solution could save a lot of troubles with the arching, acoustat and martin logan did it, and such a problem is not existing with the acoustat and martin logan.
i think that a thin homogeny coating will isolate the cause of arching, but i need more information in order to be sure. Any help and suggestions are very well come.
best regards
Williams
my big question is why 'quad company' in there good years didn't coat the stators?
this solution could save a lot of troubles with the arching, acoustat and martin logan did it, and such a problem is not existing with the acoustat and martin logan.
i think that a thin homogeny coating will isolate the cause of arching, but i need more information in order to be sure. Any help and suggestions are very well come.
best regards
Williams
Hi,
Quad coated the stators, but it´s a misbelief to think that a coating hinders arcing! It just raises the treshold of arcing, but not the principle effect. Since Quad uses rather small holes and a low percentage of openness every bit of additional coating reduces the openness of the stators. So be very careful not to change the speaker´s character here.
Additional coating may be solution to Your problem, but it doesn´t tackle the real problem which seems to be the slackening of the membrane over the years.
If You have the panels repaired the stators should get the insulative coating repaired or even completelly stripped off and a new insulative coating put on, since the arcing usually generates carbon tracks and leakage paths. You will too need a new diaphragm.
If You are not very familiar with all the needed repair steps I´d too recommend to have an expert doing the job for You.
jauu
Calvin
Quad coated the stators, but it´s a misbelief to think that a coating hinders arcing! It just raises the treshold of arcing, but not the principle effect. Since Quad uses rather small holes and a low percentage of openness every bit of additional coating reduces the openness of the stators. So be very careful not to change the speaker´s character here.
Additional coating may be solution to Your problem, but it doesn´t tackle the real problem which seems to be the slackening of the membrane over the years.
If You have the panels repaired the stators should get the insulative coating repaired or even completelly stripped off and a new insulative coating put on, since the arcing usually generates carbon tracks and leakage paths. You will too need a new diaphragm.
If You are not very familiar with all the needed repair steps I´d too recommend to have an expert doing the job for You.
jauu
Calvin
Hi,
The startor is a circuit board glued to a louvre. The copper side of the curcuit bord is facing away from the membran.
So I can't see why you should coat the stators as it would be on the outside.
I have seen 3 elements that arched in the mannor discibed by arent-jan.
Arent-jan, what glue did you use to glue tha stators back?
/Örjan
The startor is a circuit board glued to a louvre. The copper side of the curcuit bord is facing away from the membran.
So I can't see why you should coat the stators as it would be on the outside.
I have seen 3 elements that arched in the mannor discibed by arent-jan.
Arent-jan, what glue did you use to glue tha stators back?
/Örjan
hi,
you are right 'orjan' , the cooper side of the pcb is appositive to the membrane.
then the arching is causing because particles of cooper are decupling from the pcb surface or the membrane is loose and when a big swing of amplitude occurred causing the membrane to be very close to the stator will be an arch.
By coating the stator the conductive edges of the perforated pcb will be isolated as well so may be this will solve the problem even that the holes effective surface will be reduce.
Best regards
Williams
you are right 'orjan' , the cooper side of the pcb is appositive to the membrane.
then the arching is causing because particles of cooper are decupling from the pcb surface or the membrane is loose and when a big swing of amplitude occurred causing the membrane to be very close to the stator will be an arch.
By coating the stator the conductive edges of the perforated pcb will be isolated as well so may be this will solve the problem even that the holes effective surface will be reduce.
Best regards
Williams
I am surprised Ed didn't reference you to this web site, he built a pair of their kits. http://www.eraudio.com.au/ESL_Repair_Kits/esl_repair_kits.html . Rob seems like a pretty decent fellow I plan to build one of his kits.
Bill
Bill
If it's me you're referring to Bill, then I apologise. I was obviously distracted that day........
Williams
to refurbish the 63s your first port of call must be Rob Mackinlay at ERAudio...he IS a decent fellow and the least you could do is have a chat with him and benefit from the experience.....
Regards
Ed
Williams
to refurbish the 63s your first port of call must be Rob Mackinlay at ERAudio...he IS a decent fellow and the least you could do is have a chat with him and benefit from the experience.....
Regards
Ed
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