Would you paint your car using aerosol cans? I think that would be a desperate act. I have professional painting equipment including Metalflake air brush. This pail a polish was left here when I bought the place in 2005, not sure if good enuf after that age, but does nice job on floor, they even left the stuff to strip it with. sorry for getting off topic. Cheers Al
I'm not sure how to check the resistance or method used
I'm not sure how to check the resistance or method used
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Since you already have Staticide 6300 on hand, it wouldn't hurt to give it a whirl. I suspect it would be much thicker than Licron Crystal, as normally mixed for floors. However, the literature states that it's water soluble/dilute-able. Assuming that's right, the question becomes how well it works and sticks to PET film when diluted to enough to make a thin coating. The 8-oz hand-spray bottles are around $10 I think so could possibly be an economical alternative to Licron Crystal or Elvamide.
I can attest that (1) coat of Licron Crystal sprayed "just wet" is only about 2 microns thick when dry and it sticks to polyester film like white on rice. It looks thick as you spray it on but it's 98% volatile solvents so it flashes off fast to form a coating so thin it's hard to measure with a micrometer. If applied in low humidity it will dry almost clear with a slight blue-gray tint. If applied in high humidity it will dry cloudy. If you try to smooth it out with a brush or wipe it on (which I don't recommend) the coating will have prismatic streaks. Licron Crystal isn't cheap and it's not available everywhere but, performance-wise, I haven't seen anything that beats it. It's been on my latest panels for over three years and I haven't noticed any degradation at all.
BTW, I sprayed my stators with polyurethane using an automotive HVLP spray gun. I can't see how a diaphragm would relate to cars but if I had a plastic car with just 4ft2 of surface area and it needed a coating not thicker than 2-microns, a 98% solvent aerosol formulated for plastics might not be a bad choice.
I can attest that (1) coat of Licron Crystal sprayed "just wet" is only about 2 microns thick when dry and it sticks to polyester film like white on rice. It looks thick as you spray it on but it's 98% volatile solvents so it flashes off fast to form a coating so thin it's hard to measure with a micrometer. If applied in low humidity it will dry almost clear with a slight blue-gray tint. If applied in high humidity it will dry cloudy. If you try to smooth it out with a brush or wipe it on (which I don't recommend) the coating will have prismatic streaks. Licron Crystal isn't cheap and it's not available everywhere but, performance-wise, I haven't seen anything that beats it. It's been on my latest panels for over three years and I haven't noticed any degradation at all.
BTW, I sprayed my stators with polyurethane using an automotive HVLP spray gun. I can't see how a diaphragm would relate to cars but if I had a plastic car with just 4ft2 of surface area and it needed a coating not thicker than 2-microns, a 98% solvent aerosol formulated for plastics might not be a bad choice.
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I didn't have equipment to measure the resistance of the Licron on my diaphragms but I recall the data sheet does specify 10*7 to 10*9 Ohms... I just wish it were cheaper and not considered a hazardous material.
I once tried to help out a fellow ESL builder in Hong Kong who asked if I would ship him a can of Licron, since it's not sold there. As it turned out, Fed-X would ship it to Hong Kong but neither I nor Fed-X are permitted to package it for shipping-- I would have needed certified paperwork proving it was packaged by a licensed Hazmat company, and the cheapest quote I got for that was $290. Crazy huh?
BTW, Walker & Braxandall (from Quad Corp) probably did more research to model ESL's than anyone else and their white paper states the ideal coating resistance is 10*10 Ohms. Licron isn't quite that high of course but it sounds great on my panels.
From what I've read on the websites, I think all of the ESD coating products like Licron and the Staticide advertise about the same resistance. Staticide also makes an solvent based aerosol formulated especially for plastics (like Licron Crystal) that advertises the very same properties and resistance. The 6300 and other floor products are advertised as water based.
From what I've read on the websites, I think all of the ESD coating products like Licron and the Staticide advertise about the same resistance. Staticide also makes an solvent based aerosol formulated especially for plastics (like Licron Crystal) that advertises the very same properties and resistance. The 6300 and other floor products are advertised as water based.
International shipping to Hong Kong would be by air so I assumed the solvents in it (which include propane and nitro-methane) restricted if from air freight... I doubted it was a restriction unique to Hong Kong but I could be wrong... in any case, Fed-X would not air ship it to Hong Kong without certified Hazmat packaging.
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LOL Sears sells it, double the price of course up here in Canada $67 for a can, but what the heck, it's only money, and maybe last hope 
PS It was Tech Spray 1756-8S: Techspray Licron™ Crystal Permanent ESD Coating, 8-oz. Aerosol
Note: Regulated Material - Non-Hazardous only when shipped via ground service
PS It was Tech Spray 1756-8S: Techspray Licron™ Crystal Permanent ESD Coating, 8-oz. Aerosol
Note: Regulated Material - Non-Hazardous only when shipped via ground service
Hi,
67$ are a lot compared to some ounzes of water and a grain of hobby glue, that´s doing exactly the same.
Somehow we are leaving DIY here, with all the stuff to buy around.
jauu
Calvin
Something tells me that is not THE coating on your commercial panels
Cheers everybody and a Happy New Year
Alex
P.S. I've tried to find this particular glue for a while... no luck
LOL Sears sells it, double the price of course up here in Canada $67 for a can, but what the heck, it's only money, and maybe last hope
PS It was Tech Spray 1756-8S: Techspray Licron™ Crystal Permanent ESD Coating, 8-oz. Aerosol
Note: Regulated Material - Non-Hazardous only when shipped via ground service
Did not I tell YA about WATER based staff?
6300, 6400 6500 are not for the floor - they are specified as bin and visor coatings - that's what rep told me. Need a quote?
Hi,
67$ are a lot compared to some ounzes of water and a grain of hobby glue, that´s doing exactly the same.
Somehow we are leaving DIY here, with all the stuff to buy around.
jauu
Calvin
Hi Calvin,
I read about your hobby glue recipe previously. Unfortunately the brand of glue used in your recipe is not available in the U.S. Do you know of a source in Canada?
Hi,
@Charlie
Unfortunately I don't know of a source in Canada. I've been in Canada once for just a couple of days. Visited Calvin-tower in Toronto ....or was it cn-tower? Dunno, has been a while since then. Got my issue of Ron Wagners book there.
jauu
Calvin
You're of course right Alex. My Boss simply thought it'd be a rip-off from the customers if we used such a cheap coating. So I had to find and use something much more costly
@Charlie
Unfortunately I don't know of a source in Canada. I've been in Canada once for just a couple of days. Visited Calvin-tower in Toronto ....or was it cn-tower? Dunno, has been a while since then. Got my issue of Ron Wagners book there.
jauu
Calvin
Here is a little study that may help with your question.
I think that there was other threads too and if I find it I will post it for you.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/plan...rtion-electrostatic-speakers.html#post1860471
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/planars-exotics/178623-diaphram-coating.html#post2401985
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/planars-exotics/109789-esl-diaphragm-coating-8.html#post2222887
I still have not tried the PVA glue trick but here is my experiements
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/planars-exotics/109789-esl-diaphragm-coating-7.html#post2078272
This is what happens if you resistance is rather high,
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/plan...e-esl-completed-disappointed.html#post2066462
Enjoy !!
jer
jer
Thanks for the post...an time..
I think we have beat this coating deal to death....still looks like the LC is open...
Even Calvin uses diff. big $$ coating on his Killer looking ESL...an he said the PVA&Ink works well...so...well
Wow.. i went to his site..Vary Nice...
looks like he has been doing this for a sometime.
Thanks for the post...an time..
I think we have beat this coating deal to death....still looks like the LC is open...
Even Calvin uses diff. big $$ coating on his Killer looking ESL...an he said the PVA&Ink works well...so...well
Wow.. i went to his site..Vary Nice...
looks like he has been doing this for a sometime.
Hi,
@Wachara
Not everybody builds submarine Headphones You know?
I´ve stored panels coated with the glue formula in a damp, open cellar for more than 10years. Every now and then I dedust and test them. So far neither temperature nor humidity or age has changed the functioning of the coating.
It´s good to know Your experience, but this doesn´t disclude the coating alltogether, but just for certain climatic conditions.
jauu
Calvin
ps. of course a homoeopathic dose of the secret ingredient guru-spoo must be added too
@Wachara
Not everybody builds submarine Headphones You know?
I´ve stored panels coated with the glue formula in a damp, open cellar for more than 10years. Every now and then I dedust and test them. So far neither temperature nor humidity or age has changed the functioning of the coating.
It´s good to know Your experience, but this doesn´t disclude the coating alltogether, but just for certain climatic conditions.
jauu
Calvin
ps. of course a homoeopathic dose of the secret ingredient guru-spoo must be added too