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Old 17th March 2012, 09:01 AM   #101
gk7 is offline gk7
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1) First thing would be to test if your files are really identical (that was part of the claim).
I use Linux so I have the tools available, but for Windows you might try:

MD5sums for Windows
or even better:
[Announce] sha1sum for MS Windows released

2) All else being equal (playback system) there exists no mechanism that would
allow identical files to sound different, but if you can prove this in a controlled test
this would certainly change the world of computer technology. Identical files that
are different at the same time, imagine the impact on on how we see the world... ;-)
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Georg
 
Old 17th March 2012, 09:07 AM   #102
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That a digital copy is a perfect copy .... or it isn't. If the CRC's are different then the copies aren't digitally perfect !!! Simple as that.

I understand the CRC will tell us nothing about the quality, but that is not the purpose yet. The first step is to determine if there IS a difference. I believe there will be, in fact i believe if we got 1000 CRC's, no two would be the same. I could be wrong, it wouldn't be the first time.

Once we determine if their is a variance between digital rips, then we can go about testing further, to see if perhaps some drives handle better, or maybe we need to upgrade power supplies in computers, Perhaps external CD drives with dedicated power is better, even turn off services in the computer which might make noise on the SATA bus. Optimising a computer to get the most out of the sound.

But first we must either prove or dispell the myth that a CD Rip is perfect.

OR, we can just keep bashing Erin saying he hasn't provided proof, when in reality he did ( he heard it ). Yet the people who bash haven't supported their case either. Prove that all CD rips are identical !!!!

There is a reason people spend good money on good transports and good CD players. To assume that a $10 computer CD drive in a $200 computer will perform the same as a $5000 dedicated CD player just because it's digital without testing is not valid.
 
Old 17th March 2012, 09:12 AM   #103
SY is offline SY  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by godfrey View Post
Did you try a blind test to see if it still sounds better when you don't know which is which?
erin is trying one. Like I said before, no matter what the outcome, there will be a commotion, and that appeals to the sick puppy that is my soul.
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Old 17th March 2012, 09:16 AM   #104
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Yup, the disks are the same, i think even the sector size is the same ( can't remember ), however the Error correction hardware is totally different, some early Data Drives could not read Audio CD's. Like everything though, with PC's speeding up, this hardware is probably software now.
 
Old 17th March 2012, 09:26 AM   #105
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SY,

The test is irrelevant anyway, the bits will be screwed up during the email transfer.

 
Old 17th March 2012, 09:26 AM   #106
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DaveDaGr8,

In the first post, Erin said the the two files have the same checksum. As for not getting two matching checksums out of 1000 rips, have a read about AccurateRip. It relies on the majority of people being able to get the same checksum as each other.

Further, your $5000 dedicated CD player is still a CD player (red book), while a ripped .wav file is a data file. The computer CD drive is not needed for playback.

Last edited by steveh49; 17th March 2012 at 09:30 AM.
 
Old 17th March 2012, 09:28 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SY View Post
erin is trying one. Like I said before, no matter what the outcome, there will be a commotion, and that appeals to the sick puppy that is my soul.
Is it your 5+5 test? If so, the files should be made public IMO so people can check for ways to group them without listening.
 
Old 17th March 2012, 09:36 AM   #108
SY is offline SY  United States
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I'll see if that's possible. erin and I will discuss in email what he needs- if excerpts will do, that's one thing, whole songs are another. The issues with having them publicly available are download limits and copyright.
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Old 17th March 2012, 09:45 AM   #109
godfrey is offline godfrey  South Africa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveDaGr8 View Post
How about Track 1 off Brothers in arms ?. Rip it and post your CRC.
That's almost a good idea except that there's probably a dozen different versions out there to start with (rereleases etc ).
A few years ago I tried to buy "Dark Side of the Moon" at a local store. They had several flavors of New improved / digitally remastered / now with added bonus tracks etc. Nothing that pretended to sound like the original though.
 
Old 17th March 2012, 09:52 AM   #110
godfrey is offline godfrey  South Africa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazybutt View Post
SY,

The test is irrelevant anyway, the bits will be screwed up during the email transfer.

You'd think so, wouldn't you? However I remember a previous similar thread that claimed audible differences between bit-identical files remained even after the files were uploaded to a server, then downloaded by others.
 

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