I just test this new Windows software and think I need to share my impression here. Download here : JPLAY - hi-end audio player for Windows . Please note that I'm in no way affiliated with the developer, so this is not a marketing post.
I used Foobar2K for years and have tested other like Jriver, Mediamonkey, etc and always come back to Foobar for lot of different reasons (SQ, usability, etc). Last night I tested Jplay and I think I cannot live without it anymore (means I will have less 99 euros on my bank account).
Compared to my foobar setup, JPlay has more "body", spaciousness and details. And that's with my fairly simple setup, I believe it will shows more of its' potential on better system. And that's on it's default setup, I haven't played around with more advanced settings. It is clear that it force the system to concentrate all of its' CPU power and RAM to play music only as while the music is playing, the PC become very slow and less responsive.
It can run as independent application with minimalist GUI or as foobar component, so I still have the usability of Foobar (interface, library, etc). There are many so-called audiophile player (ulilith, cplay, etc). But their user interface are barely usable for my needs. It can also work with JRiver and iTunes
(not tested yet).
Bad side (tested with Foobar only) :
Will see how JPlay compares to PurePlayer (another one I like very much, but lacking on the interface side). It will be great if the developer of Pureplayer takes the same approach with Jplay to integrate with other music library program.
I used Foobar2K for years and have tested other like Jriver, Mediamonkey, etc and always come back to Foobar for lot of different reasons (SQ, usability, etc). Last night I tested Jplay and I think I cannot live without it anymore (means I will have less 99 euros on my bank account).
Compared to my foobar setup, JPlay has more "body", spaciousness and details. And that's with my fairly simple setup, I believe it will shows more of its' potential on better system. And that's on it's default setup, I haven't played around with more advanced settings. It is clear that it force the system to concentrate all of its' CPU power and RAM to play music only as while the music is playing, the PC become very slow and less responsive.
It can run as independent application with minimalist GUI or as foobar component, so I still have the usability of Foobar (interface, library, etc). There are many so-called audiophile player (ulilith, cplay, etc). But their user interface are barely usable for my needs. It can also work with JRiver and iTunes
(not tested yet).Bad side (tested with Foobar only) :
- No gapless playback (because it is a memory player, I suppose)
- It is not interfaced well with Foobar uPNP component. The renderer function doesn't work, it cannot retrieve songs from uPNP server. So for know I have to stick with foobar HTTP interface to remotely control it.
- Not free
Will see how JPlay compares to PurePlayer (another one I like very much, but lacking on the interface side). It will be great if the developer of Pureplayer takes the same approach with Jplay to integrate with other music library program.
I've tested the full file buffering (I think I set it around 50000kB), foobar + jplay still sounds better. Will test Foobar + Fidelizer tonight.
It does gapless in hibernate mode. The feedback is universal regarding how good it is and I have to agree. I am pretty sure I have read users preferring it to Cplay. It sure is a lot easier to get up and running, quick customer service and support (Why is the Cplay forum based in audioasylum which is a fancy BBS board for all intents and purposes). It's gotten major publication coverage and it's only a year old. Whether or not that's worth the money is another question.
There is nothing user-friendly about the cplay site. Everytime I am about to give it a go I look at the 'guides' and know it's going to be a whole long process and I just don't bother.
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And thats why you will never know how good cPlay is
The cPlay site itself is actually very good, but it does require a person to click on menus which take a person to the next page, which perhaps is difficult for some?
I interpret what you are saying to mean.
Jplay is for those who are lazy and second best will do.
So, you "read" of "users" who "said" that they "prefered" Jplay over cPlay. Because its "easier"???
cPlay also has had a major review here http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/viewpoint/0708/aachapter105.htm and at the time of the review was only a year or so old. But really, big deal.
And for what its worth I take all reviews with a pinch of salt, however I personally trust online reviews or comments in forums over print media reviews as there is more commercial interest in magazines. But anyway, you didn't cite your reference so who knows what you are talking about.
And to continue on with your rant you criticise Audioasylum?? Why? What point dose that prove.
OK, so why do you hang out one DiyAudio? Presumably because you think that commercial products are made with compromises and you prefer to modify or design your own gear which is better than you can get off the shelf, and now you are applauding some software which is "off the shelf" yet still allows windows to operate and read email at the same time???
Well if you are going to tell me that Jplay stops other services etc. Well cPlay does whatever Jplay does, but takes it further, does it better, did it first, and costs absolutely nothing! and the website offers suggestions on how to tweak your operating system and your PC, and the Audioasylum thread has awesome suggestions from really dedicated PC audio people who tweak the c^&p out of their computers to get the best sound.
I almost forgot to say, that if Jplay is so easy why would you even need support?
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Nothing interesting about it. Typical Hydrogen audio thread. Been that way for years. I'm sure most of the projects on diyaudio would get the same treatment.
And thats why you will never know how good cPlay is
The cPlay site itself is actually very good, but it does require a person to click on menus which take a person to the next page, which perhaps is difficult for some?
I interpret what you are saying to mean.
Jplay is for those who are lazy and second best will do.
So, you "read" of "users" who "said" that they "prefered" Jplay over cPlay. Because its "easier"???
cPlay also has had a major review here Audiolics Anonymous Chapter 105: Home Theater Computer Pt. 2, Pinnacle PCTV HD Pro Stick Article By Bill Gaw and at the time of the review was only a year or so old. But really, big deal.
And for what its worth I take all reviews with a pinch of salt, however I personally trust online reviews or comments in forums over print media reviews as there is more commercial interest in magazines. But anyway, you didn't cite your reference so who knows what you are talking about.
And to continue on with your rant you criticise Audioasylum?? Why? What point dose that prove.
OK, so why do you hang out one DiyAudio? Presumably because you think that commercial products are made with compromises and you prefer to modify or design your own gear which is better than you can get off the shelf, and now you are applauding some software which is "off the shelf" yet still allows windows to operate and read email at the same time???
Well if you are going to tell me that Jplay stops other services etc. Well cPlay does whatever Jplay does, but takes it further, does it better, did it first, and costs absolutely nothing! and the website offers suggestions on how to tweak your operating system and your PC, and the Audioasylum thread has awesome suggestions from really dedicated PC audio people who tweak the c^&p out of their computers to get the best sound.
I almost forgot to say, that if Jplay is so easy why would you even need support?
Easy partner. I was giving the pros and cons (from my perspective). Some people like going down the rabbit hole and scouring threads for hours and hours and doing mods and yadda yadda. Some people like to hit play and have done with - but come on, just because something is easier to use doesn't mean it's inferior. And Jplay is 'off the shelf'???! You do realize it's changed a lot since it's inception, right? 'Off the shelf'? Not quite, the newest version maybe... And I assume you're joking about the support question. Btw, that ETM article is from 3 years ago, no? Anyhoos -
I don't get the 'who knows what I am talking about' as though you can't find user feedback on jplay. Really?? Come on. And did I say people prefer it to cplay because it's easier, or did the period not do it's job?
'Lazy', 'second best', 'your rant'(two sentences qualify as a rant?)... Milady doth protest... lest she thinks I fabricate.
If you like Cplay, great. I have heard great things about CMP Cplay. And yes, I have also tried it. Not my cup of tea and I found better performance elsewhere. But Jplay is the real deal and you can't deny their success. They are doing something right. Like I said, it's up to whomever to decide if the cost is worth it. They DO have a free demo, you know...
Maybe you take me for a fanboy. I am not. I own Jplay as well as MPCHC, stealthaudioplayer,jrmc, XXHE, etc etc...
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OK, cool, now perhaps you can tell me purely based on sound quality alone, why you think Jplay "performs" better, I presume you mean sounds better than CMP + cPlay. More detail? More depth? Higher highs? lower Lows?
Seriously, I want to know, if you are willing to indulge...
Also, which version of CMP + cPlay did you try. And I do presume you tried the full CMP + cPlay, not just the cPlay that plays music on the regular windows desktop. I also presume you "optimised" your PC according to the instructions on the CMP website, and implemented minlogon?
All the optimisations are part of the cPlay "thing". Simply installing and running it on a stock OS does not give the best sound, and is not the way it is intended to be used.
Now, the forum to which you linked in your last post, where the person claiming that Jplay sounds better than cPlay did not mention if he did "optimise" his OS. In my experience from reading forums, those who are dedicated to cPlay are very happy to mention that they optimised their OS. My "feeling" is that this person did not go to much trouble here, and so I take his comments with a pinch of salt.
Thanks
Seriously, I want to know, if you are willing to indulge...
Also, which version of CMP + cPlay did you try. And I do presume you tried the full CMP + cPlay, not just the cPlay that plays music on the regular windows desktop. I also presume you "optimised" your PC according to the instructions on the CMP website, and implemented minlogon?
All the optimisations are part of the cPlay "thing". Simply installing and running it on a stock OS does not give the best sound, and is not the way it is intended to be used.
Now, the forum to which you linked in your last post, where the person claiming that Jplay sounds better than cPlay did not mention if he did "optimise" his OS. In my experience from reading forums, those who are dedicated to cPlay are very happy to mention that they optimised their OS. My "feeling" is that this person did not go to much trouble here, and so I take his comments with a pinch of salt.
Thanks
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I really enjoyed reading about it, and it was interesting how the programmer of Jplay couldn't answer his critics in any meaningful way.
However in his defense, the guys on hydrogenaudio did seem to be of the "bits are bits" school of thought, which I do not subscribe. It can be challenging to argue against those head in sand type of people.
Perhaps someone using Jplay can open taskmanager when Jplay is running and tell me which services are left running, which have been stopped, how many threads and handles are being executed and how much of the pagefile is being used with no music loaded.
This will give an indication of what Jplay is doing, and might also be an indicator of its performance level.
This will give an indication of what Jplay is doing, and might also be an indicator of its performance level.
So it seems we can't know what Jplay is actually doing to the processes. We just have to trust the author?
Taskmanager would tell you how many MB are in the pagefile even if the pagefile is disabled. Its a shame you can't open taskmanager.
What it is doing in Hibernate mode is the thing I want to know. Is it possible to open taskmanager and then execute Hybernate mode, which would leave taskmanager running?
Supposing Hybernate mode does shut down most processes, it seems like the concept and execution is so similar to cPlay, that in theory there should be a negligible sonic difference?
And this is why I have trouble swallowing the 99 Euro charge for the software. We have one software which is free and one costing 99 Euro, yet both doing effectively the same thing.
Taskmanager would tell you how many MB are in the pagefile even if the pagefile is disabled. Its a shame you can't open taskmanager.
What it is doing in Hibernate mode is the thing I want to know. Is it possible to open taskmanager and then execute Hybernate mode, which would leave taskmanager running?
Supposing Hybernate mode does shut down most processes, it seems like the concept and execution is so similar to cPlay, that in theory there should be a negligible sonic difference?
And this is why I have trouble swallowing the 99 Euro charge for the software. We have one software which is free and one costing 99 Euro, yet both doing effectively the same thing.
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Just. Use. The. Demo. The demo is free. you can play with it all you want and make up your own mind. or just stick with cplay. or post on the jplay forum and ask the authors, who are very accessible. you are going to great lengths to make assumptions about something you can easily judge/inquire for yourself. isn't that better than other user feedback or published reviews?
I can't/won't answer your previous question because like your other post, it assumes I made statements I didn't make. this is my last post on the subject as I think you are looking to have a hypothetical debate or waiting for someone here to confirm what you already believe to be true as opposed to really informing yourself. I may not prefer cplay, but I am relatively informed on it and respect that those who are willing to 'go the distance' as far as optimizations get great performance from it.
it's like talking about how awesome linux is vs. everything else.
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No it seems that you just don't want to say how optimised your cPlay trial was, and how it sounded subjectively vs Jplay. In other words taking your bat and ball and going home.
I'm happy to listen to what others have to say, and happy to discuss it, as long as there are meaningful subjective sonic comparisons made rather than very general sweeping statements that one is better than the other just "because".
Not helpful.
I. cant. run. Jplay. because. I. only. have.1G. of. RAM. and. it. says. that. minimum. requirements. are. 2G. Hence why I ask questions before spending money.
I didn't necessarily want to discuss it with you.
So far I have read the review on enjoy the music where from what I read, the best thing that the reviewer had to say about Jplay was that it was more musical than foobar or cPlay, and to me that is not a comparative review which would justify further interest in the product. Also his mention of foobar in the same sentence as cPlay seems to indicate that he thinks they are somewhere on the same field which I believe that they are not, and so hence I find his comments meaningless. So my question is to anyone who has a fully optimised OS and runs cPlay as their primary music source to provide a subjective AB review vs Jplay. Blind tests are not necessary, just someones honest review. I look forward to it.
So far I have read the review on enjoy the music where from what I read, the best thing that the reviewer had to say about Jplay was that it was more musical than foobar or cPlay, and to me that is not a comparative review which would justify further interest in the product. Also his mention of foobar in the same sentence as cPlay seems to indicate that he thinks they are somewhere on the same field which I believe that they are not, and so hence I find his comments meaningless. So my question is to anyone who has a fully optimised OS and runs cPlay as their primary music source to provide a subjective AB review vs Jplay. Blind tests are not necessary, just someones honest review. I look forward to it.
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I haven't heard J-Play compared to anything else, but I have heard it compared to itself in standard vs hibernate mode, with no expectations or preconceptions, and the latter was clearly better in terms of space, texture, subjective dynamics and just the sense of a real musical event rather than a recording. The tracks I heard were recordings from an extremely good turntable. In hibernate mode the sound was virtually identical to the original. In standard mode- or whatever they actually call it- it sounded good, but clearly less interesting, lively, etc. It was running on what appeared to be a perfectly ordinary laptop, through a Rega DAC- although the latter is being upgraded to a JKDAC 32 apparently. It's a pity the user interface is so basic when 'hibernating', but sound quality seems to be excellent and may well result in a change my own system in the next year or so.
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