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Old 21st December 2010, 09:31 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allanjelly View Post

ps. To all reading this thread - I've tested Soundcheck's mods and they really work. I've done BLIND a/b tests and I can distinguish modded vs unmodded system 10/10. Is it enough for non-believers? If you cannot hear the difference either you're deaf or your system is simply not resolving enough.
I've done blind tests to standard/linear power supply and to local/server flac decoding. I'm using SPDIF out all the time. After that i started trusting my ears more and i haven't done proper tests to wifi on/off and other minor upgrades but their cumulative influence is also positive.
THX for writing up your experience.


I agree to your statement about the effects per modification being cumulative altogether.

I'd go a step further. It IMO doesn't make sense to dissect those mods.
They - to a great extent - depend on each other.
E.g. You can`t run a very small buffer, if the system is too slow in managing those small sizes. That means the buffer mod (at lowest value) will only work if the other mods are applied beforehand.

Not to forget to mention another side effect or better limitation: The lowest buffer setting might work on 44/16, while 24/96 is causing XRUNS.
Or decoding flacs on the server improves performance on 44.1/16 but makes things worse on 24/96 (there is much more traffic to handle).
The consequence would be:
1. To find the best compromise (you'd obviously be compromising the last
bit of SQ)
2. To have a dynamically changing configuration on a per
samplerate/bitdepth basis.

Again, the basic idea behind my modifications is to reduce as much activities/load/interrupts/distortion/noise/PS load variations/asf.
as possible. As usual - at a certain point you have to go for the best compromise.

Cheers
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Old 21st December 2010, 09:46 AM   #122
phofman is offline phofman  Czech Republic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post
Again, the basic idea behind my modifications is to reduce as much activities/load/interrupts/distortion/noise/PS load variations/asf.
as possible. As usual - at a certain point you have to go for the best compromise.

Cheers
Come on, serving the shorter alsa buffer requires more load/interrupts/activites. Plus brings a much bigger danger of xruns, especially for higher fs.
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Old 21st December 2010, 10:01 AM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phofman View Post
Noone has ever disputed that replacing the noisy SMPS with a linear one will yield sonic improvements.



Even that is explainable - lowering CPU activity = lower noise on supply lines with direct impact on SPDIF output jitter.
Where are your noise and jitter measurements confirming your claims?
Ever done measurements inside the PC to figure out the CPU load related jitter and noise impact on SPDIF?
You wouldn't believe others doing measurements or word-of-mouth propaganda , wouldn't you?

Or have you just experienced it?
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Old 21st December 2010, 10:28 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phofman View Post
Come on, serving the shorter alsa buffer requires more load/interrupts/activites. Plus brings a much bigger danger of xruns, especially for higher fs.
You might guess that after digging into the subject for a little while,
I'm well aware that very small buffers (I just wrote it 3 posts earlier)
might cause instabilities under normal conditions. Though we're not
running under and talking about normal conditions here.

I do also know that buffer management is causing interrupts, buffer management (flush and fill). HW interrupts need to get in sync with
the processor asf. asf.

I don't have an explanation for the experienced effects. Why should I?

If I'd try to figure out any root cause of all those mods. I'd probably
need a team of engineers, tons of equipment and a bucket full of money.

The point is:

I'm consequently following my overall strategy. And that seems
to work. (And it works not only on my system.) This is the most
efficient approach I can think of.

I btw also need some time for listening to my gear.
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Old 21st December 2010, 10:36 AM   #125
phofman is offline phofman  Czech Republic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post
Where are your noise and jitter measurements confirming your claims?
Ever done measurements inside the PC to figure out the CPU load related jitter and noise impact on SPDIF?
You wouldn't believe others doing measurements or word-of-mouth propaganda , wouldn't you?

Or have you just experienced it?
b) is true. On one machine I have a tripath amp supplied by 12V directly from the PC and when the volume if fully up I can hear mouse moving (interrupts), letters appearing in terminal (interrupts), harddrive working (load variation, interrupts). On another machine I can hear CPU working - the coils on the onboard step-down converter form the CPU are somewhat loose and thus producing a very audible noise. I can imagine what the CPU load does to supply lines electric noise.

Just like what shorter alsa buffers do, forcing the card throw "done with processing your data" interrupts like crazy and the application to wake up every few milisecs and feed the buffer with tiny bursts of data, instead of doing it once a second or even longer and letting the card do its job on its own. It takes no major knowledge, just a bit of common sense.
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Old 21st December 2010, 10:43 AM   #126
phofman is offline phofman  Czech Republic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post
I'm consequently following my overall strategy.
If your overall strategy as stated in the previous post is reducing interrupts/CPU load/activites, then with the short buffer mod you are doing the exact opposite.

Quote:
Originally Posted by soundcheck View Post
And that seems to work.
Yes, it seems to work to you. But please do not exclude the qualifier "seems to" from your resolute statements, others believing you may get confused.

Last edited by phofman; 21st December 2010 at 10:45 AM.
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Old 21st December 2010, 12:10 PM   #127
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phofman.

please stop to poison over and over any thread I've started.

I just said. I do not have any explanation for this or that effect.
I don't intend to figure out what's causing it.
The point is - You don't have any clue either, even worse, you'd
never try those modifications.

I do respect your background and competence in
certain areas.

But I do my stuff. You do yours (whatever that is - beside commenting my posts)

Your comments over here IMO doesn't lead anywhere. People have to read all this destructive stuff.


If you're willing to contribute modifications for a Squeezebox Touch,
you're invited - at least from my perspective . Though I doubt that I will see any constructive contribution coming from your side soon.

If you own a Touch ( probably not even that is the case) just run it the way it is and enjoy.
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Old 21st December 2010, 12:44 PM   #128
phofman is offline phofman  Czech Republic
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You are right, I will not post to this thread. I just could not refrain from commenting on the brainwash. My fault, sorry.

Last edited by phofman; 21st December 2010 at 12:47 PM.
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Old 21st December 2010, 07:45 PM   #129
Malka07 is offline Malka07  England
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Just wanted to say, that about 2 weeks ago i did the mods from Soundcheck's old Blog...i am using the Touch as a transport...there is a definite, quite substantial improvement...to tell you the truth everything improves, but the things that stood out to me, was the big open 3d soundstage, the cleaness of sound and dynamics. To me these mods transform the Touch as a transport from a hifi sound to a LIVE sound. And this is without upgrading the power supply to a linear supply!!! This i will build as soon as i have funds.

Thank you very much for sharing the mods Soundcheck...i highly recommend anyone with a Touch to do the mods, try for yourself and see.

I also hope that you get the current situation sorted. All the best. Looking forward to trying all the other new mods

Alon

EDIT 'OH yeah forgot to say...the BASS after the mods sounds AWESOME!!'

Last edited by Malka07; 21st December 2010 at 07:48 PM. Reason: Forgot to type something
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Old 22nd December 2010, 12:45 AM   #130
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I hope the blog returns as well, as my SqueezeBox Touch only just arrived...
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