sound of amps

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sound of amps is a question that I like, althought it may be a personnal feeling , and also a good combination with speakers ,
I am currently building an aleph 30 ,just to have the pleasure to use a DIY amp in my system...,but am really curious about what diffrence could exist compared to production amps like SAE, GAS or JEFF ROWLAND amps...these are my preffered amps (deep bass , nice med , and reliability)
actually building your own amp is an experience more than just a challenge...,but can we say that a DIYproject as an aleph clone
will be able to compare to an AMPZILLA or SAE bass reponse?
any input would be appreciated, as I really love DIY projects and
am curious about sound experimentationyou all could have
Vince
 
Yeah!
Bob just rules , he loves this kind of challenge...So do I, but this is all about what combined response you will get with your speaker (mostly low end response) VS amp, sure the internal impedance of the system makes your amp sound diffrent, tubes VS bipolars sounds diffrent because of that (but not only...) , also you can put resistors between your amp and woofers to damp the low end curve (what JBL does in their professionnal speakers) to help control better the big 15"or get a better combined response or modify the Qts wether teh speaker is used clos or Bass reflex...

BUT, this seem to me like minor, even if you lower the rise time or modify the solid state amp so that it can sound as slow as a tube amp, that's what Bob did in a certaim manner in a test he made in the early 80's Vs a Tube amp... , this is not what I was talking about,
mainly my thoughts and questions were more about solid states amps compared to each other (excluding tubes), of course when they use an output transformer they sount really diffrent, just like between tubes and direct output devices (Mack or Jbl from the 70's)
actually I am curious about howan aleph 30 or even 100w would drive JBL monitors compared to an SAE from similar power, would it give deep bass? I will sure have the answer as i am building one, but would love to have some opinions from everybody
and please excuse for my english
Vince
:smash:
 
Vince,

You will likely be pleased with your Aleph30 provided your speakers are relatively efficient or you dont listen really loud. If anything, the A30 will err on the side of sweet 2nd harmonic distortion.

Once your active electronics get to a certain level, your speakers will matter more. If you go the active crossover biamp/triamp route you may find that you can match the amplifier to the driver.

In recent days, I've been swapping tweeters in/out of my DIY speakers. I'm hearing MUCH greater differences with speaker changes than with any amplifier change.

For example, I've been using Threshold/Pass amps in the wintertime. In the summer I switch to cheap receivers that put out less heat. My speakers dont sound quite as good, but the differences are much less than a change of EQ or driver. My speakers "tone" is suprisingly similar between the different amps. I suspect that my use of triamp with active crossover has something to do with that.

Dont worry about your A30 being "good enough".
 
Daveis,
thanks for the review regarding aleph 30,
definately impatient to test it!!!
not that I need lots of SPL actually 10 watts is enough to bother the neighbours:hot: , but hope this will drive correctly the 15" woofer (speakers are bi amped with an active EQdbx drpa)
vince
 
Dunno .. Mate,.. despite bleatings to the Contrary a decent Rowland Amp simply sounds better.
Could be the reason they outsell the Alephss.. hands down.. But you be the judge your ears are yours alone.
There are 'Many' ideas as to Audio amps, some simply sound better than others... despite the hype.
 
Be sure to check the postings regarding adjustiment of the "AC gain"
of an Aleph amp -- especially if the bias is the stock value or less (2A).

On my system with relatively low efficient speakers (86db, 4-6ohms)
I have found that
too low of an AC gain will make the sound not
crisp and you can hear some distortion. Also make sure that
both sides have the same AC gain -- I have found that small differences can be
very noticeable. YMMV.

P.Lambda
 
The one and only
Joined 2001
Paid Member
Bare said:
despite bleatings to the Contrary a decent Rowland Amp simply sounds better.
Could be the reason they outsell the Alephss.. hands down..

From this week's mail:

"when I told a friend I was about to make one of your Aleph amps he told me that it was for sure one of the best amps he ever heard even compared to his JEFF ROWLAND or SAE"
 
I don't know the Aleph 30, but Jeff Rowland amps don't amaze me :dead:
I prefer a Krell KAV 300i with a good pre amp, instead of the chip amp made by Jeff Rowland.
But in Europe we have a lot of products for the same price that perform much better..... ( I don't think that Jeff Rowland sells a lot in Europe(CE) )
But I am not saying that his amps are bad, far away from that... but they just don't amaze me ;)
 
Nelson Pass said:
It's strictly a matter of taste and how an amplifier complements
the other components.
If I thought there was any kind of
absolute I would have lost interest long ago.

Yes, that's the point :cool:


BTW, the Jeff Rowland chip amp it's very accurate but my taste demands a more "evolving" amp, especially with deep and dynamic bass :D



But Nelson, we all know that each of us has unique tastes but, we all have to know to be impartial. This means that even if I don't like it very much, I must describe the full potential of the amp.



PS: If I made all the amps that the users of this forum say that are the best ones, I think I would need to rent a warehouse :D
Each one has the best amp.... as usual :dead: :D :angel:
 
Yes of course I am recently experimenting what Nelson is talking about, actually it really is a "taste" thing, I have to say that Ireally was convinced about an absolute to exist , just like I was also concerning speakers also...
maybe my starting subject: about comparing sounds of amps as a criteria of "value" is in some manner the wrong approch of the question...
my way to compare amps in the past (when my speakers weren't well filtered cause DIY...without enough experiment (i have to admit) it was easy to deliberate on the quality of the amp connected on them, as they used 15" woofers and compression drivers (badly filtered) the only amps that could make them sound nice where those able to drive high current so the 15" would always sound tight and not lazy (so exit tubes and lots of other solid states) in fact professionnal amps were on this system sounding really accurate...
then I made "my" criteria of what a good amp should sound like in absolute: tight low and deep bass , and smooth medium ...
but I had to put the amp on my speakers to tell if I like it or not...
actually it was difficult for me to juge about it's quality if I was listening outside of my system...
sure now I EQed all my system from about +3-3db from 60 to 16khz sounds great with much a larger line of amps , and even small amps can show subtilities big Dinosaurs can't,
so yes I guess that is is a "taste thing " more than an absolute to reach, but I can't help from asking people about their own experience,
of course I'll be able to juge for myself soon with the Aleph 30!!!, but just love to share experiences about sound !
 
Yeah ,
actually they made a strong reputation over here(maybe due to their high prices in a certain manner)but I have to admit that they are really well finished and look like something really well built, I remember their advertisings 5 years ago with their top faceplate taken off , maketing a lot using the"placebo thing" I mean if it's beautiful inside then it will sound excellent...
anyway they totally changed their schematics topology and now make classe D amps , well they sound good, nothing to criticize in particular, but what is amazing is the size and weight they have now with these "TV sets" power supplys they weight only ablut 10Kilos maybe 4 to 5 times less than what they were weighing before they changed the schematics...is that a progress?, yes for sure regarding to the weightVs power,but maybe not concerning the improvement in sound
IMO..
 
The one and only
Joined 2001
Paid Member
Originally Jeff had conventional but well done discrete circuits, but then he kind of wandered off into chips and then the Class D modules. The constant is that he has retained what is arguably
the finest metal, and in certain markets that is adequate to
sustain sales.

Personally I don't argue the sonic merits of commercial chips
and modules, I just don't find them very interesting.
 
I just find that when you consider the actual operational parameters of the human hearing mechanism, and weigh that against all electrical parameters that a signal must deal with, or be transferred by/through....then it becomes abundantly clear as to why a given component, piece of gear, or part,-- sounds different than another.

If one is in the audio business, it is best to keep one's business neighbours ignorant of those salient details of the human hearing mechanism..and to simply smile and shrug when they call you 'out'. :)
 
Go build a Zen 1 and compare!!! That would be a good starting point for a discussion like this one.

Most of the amps in discussion have not been listened to under the same conditions (ie in your everyday listening premises).

I find this type of discussion rather hard to take serious, as most of the contributers have little or none experience with the equipment under known conditions.

Magura :)
 
Magura said:
Go build a Zen 1 and compare!!! That would be a good starting point for a discussion like this one.

Most of the amps in discussion have not been listened to under the same conditions (ie in your everyday listening premises).

I find this type of discussion rather hard to take serious, as most of the contributers have little or none experience with the equipment under known conditions.

Magura :)


From my point of view, I find (sometimes) this type of discussion unreal because everyone has the best amp.....
It's like the discussion of the penis, all people have porno star penis, bigger than the others :dead: :rolleyes: :dead:


Our discussions should improve amps, DAC's, etc... not only our EGO:dead:
 
XELB said:



From my point of view, I find (sometimes) this type of discussion unreal because everyone has the best amp.....
It's like the discussion of the penis, all people have porno star penis, bigger than the others :dead: :rolleyes: :dead:


Our discussions should improve amps, DAC's, etc... not only our EGO:dead:


Yes, naturally everybody has the best amp :)

What I find even more problematic, is the lack of a reference point!

Magura :)
 
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