Correct signal phase integrity

kirc · 19th September 2002, 12:29 PM

I have one question.

My opinion is that Bride of Zen invert the phase of the signal, but Penultimate Zen V4 does not. To adjust the absolute phase I reverse the cables on Zen V4 output. Is this correct ?

best regards,
Leon

mrfeedback · 19th September 2002, 04:37 PM

Yes, except that recorded polarity changes from record to record, and track to track.
You need to be able to invert system polarity at will.

Eric.

stefanobilliani · 19th September 2002, 05:55 PM

I prefer to listen to the records as they are recorded;
with the absolute phase right .

I think also that the absolute phase may become a factor of personal taste.

skaara · 19th September 2002, 06:02 PM

Are there hearable differences?

stefanobilliani · 19th September 2002, 06:08 PM

At least at my opinion the answer is yes.
But don't know how to explain it .

mrfeedback · 19th September 2002, 06:19 PM

Pay attention to polarised sources like drums and vocals.
Vocals sound like someone speaking towards you, or their back facing you according to polarity.
You need flat phase characteristic speakers to hear it properly.
Warning - Once you understand and can hear the difference you can't go back.

Eric.

stefanobilliani · 19th September 2002, 06:23 PM

I agree . Completely .

pjkunz · 19th September 2002, 06:36 PM

I think he's just asking if the Z4 has an inverted output. It does as far as I can tell. The buffer as implemented is not inverting, and the gain stage still is. so BOZ+ZV4 should = correct phasing. I also modelled the circuit just to double check.

-Regards

kirc · 19th September 2002, 06:54 PM

I also prefer to listen to the records as they are recorded.

Yes, I made a big mistake while I wrote the post.

BOZ invert phase and Zen V4 also invert phase. The input buffer does not invert, but output stage invert. So the absolute phase is correct. The Zen V4 shematic show the output on output capacitor as - and GND as +. Is this becouse ZEN invert phase ? (my opinion is that this is this). So combination ZEN V4 and BOZ does not invert the absolute phase, so output on output capacitor is + and GND is - to speaker.

best regards,
Leon

19th September 2002, 04:37 PM	#2
mrfeedback diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Perth, Australia.	Acoustic Polarity, Not Equipment Polarity Yes, except that recorded polarity changes from record to record, and track to track. You need to be able to invert system polarity at will. Eric.

19th September 2002, 06:19 PM	#6
mrfeedback diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Perth, Australia.	It Is Loud And Clear. Pay attention to polarised sources like drums and vocals. Vocals sound like someone speaking towards you, or their back facing you according to polarity. You need flat phase characteristic speakers to hear it properly. Warning - Once you understand and can hear the difference you can't go back. Eric.

19th September 2002, 06:54 PM	#9
kirc diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Slovenia	I also prefer to listen to the records as they are recorded. Yes, I made a big mistake while I wrote the post. BOZ invert phase and Zen V4 also invert phase. The input buffer does not invert, but output stage invert. So the absolute phase is correct. The Zen V4 shematic show the output on output capacitor as - and GND as +. Is this becouse ZEN invert phase ? (my opinion is that this is this). So combination ZEN V4 and BOZ does not invert the absolute phase, so output on output capacitor is + and GND is - to speaker. best regards, Leon __________________ Music is a part of my life, DIY is my life.

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19th September 2002, 05:55 PM	#3
stefanobilliani diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Italy	I prefer to listen to the records as they are recorded; with the absolute phase right . I think also that the absolute phase may become a factor of personal taste.

19th September 2002, 06:02 PM	#4
skaara diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Europe, Slovenia	Are there hearable differences?

19th September 2002, 06:08 PM	#5
stefanobilliani diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Italy	At least at my opinion the answer is yes. But don't know how to explain it .

19th September 2002, 06:23 PM	#7
stefanobilliani diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Italy	I agree . Completely .

19th September 2002, 06:36 PM	#8
pjkunz diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Palo Alto, CA	I think he's just asking if the Z4 has an inverted output. It does as far as I can tell. The buffer as implemented is not inverting, and the gain stage still is. so BOZ+ZV4 should = correct phasing. I also modelled the circuit just to double check. -Regards

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