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Old 13th February 2004, 10:31 PM   #511
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Sincere thanks to you for your efforts. It's just great how the simplicity of the circuits couples with your ability to give such a good explanation. Even if I can't or don't wish to build each project, I get great enjoyment out of reading them and learn something from every one.

I'm sure that there are many thousands out there who are appreciative.
Vince Harris
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Old 13th February 2004, 10:41 PM   #512
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I built my first Pass amp, an A40, when I was in the military, and I've been hooked ever since. It's a hobby I love and Nelson has contributed more to my understanding and enjoyment than any other in the DIY community. In fact, when I finally had the means to do so, I schlepped all the way to the Las Vegas CES to thank him personally.

I normally avoid these controversial threads, but I'm embarrassed by Grataku's comments, and If I could apologize for someone else's rudeness, I would. But since I can't, let me once again, offer my thanks to Mr. Pass for giving me many hours of education and enjoyment. We're lucky the guy's a good sport.


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Old 13th February 2004, 10:53 PM   #513
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Originally posted by grataku
One can say one million great things about and thank someone a million times but if you only complain once that's all they can remember.
OK, I feel better now

But seriously, how do you know a priori that an XSOZ
based on the original SOZ framework might not be the best
amplifier for a particular loudspeaker? My own experience is
that all these designs, dumb as some of them are, offer
something to somebody, often in a surprising way.

When I first did SOZ, there was opinion (on some other forum)
that I was just perpetrating a joke. Well, if you read the first
few paragraphs, it was pretty tongue-in-cheek, but still think of
it as an interesting design, and I've been surprised at how many
people built and loved it. I've always suspected that these
were people more familiar with welders and soldering irons.

In any case, the SOZ really does serve as a great introduction
to X feedback, particularly for those who aren't brainiacs.
Besides that, what person with a SOZ will be able to resist
spending 5 bucks upgrading it?

So be patient, I've got 4 more ZV's to do this year, I'll have
fulfilled my commitment to Ed Dell of AE magazine, and the
Aleph X is not the last one...
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Old 13th February 2004, 10:56 PM   #514
Coulomb is offline Coulomb  England
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Wow, this thread took an ugly turn!

Let us not forget the name of this Forum and who is ultimately the source of all that flows from it. We are but PASSengers on a ship that can only have one Captain. With no disrespect to any of the very fine designers on this Forum, but there would not be much of a platform for your ideas without the support of PASS Labs.

Coming from a 100% IP company (Drug Discovery), I have given much thought to why Nelson would share so much of his time and knowledge with people he know's nothing about.

In my mind he obviously feels that the exchange of information is a two way street and he occasionally takes away valuable insight himself. I think that this venue probably appeals to his basic hobbyist nature and enjoys spending time with us.

So for heavens sake let's make sure he is at all times treated like a cherished old friend who has come to our homes to spread some cheer.

I need a drink.

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Old 13th February 2004, 11:05 PM   #515
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Here's your drink.

I forgot to mention that really I don't have any problem with
you guys reverse engineering my stuff. Realistically, you can
do that whether I like it or not, and I prefer to be at the head
of the parade.....

At the same time, I have always assumed that one of the
motivations of the typical DIYer is the joy of discovering things
for one's self, and toward that end, I think it's more fun to
scatter bread crumbs along the path than to install a trolley line.

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Old 13th February 2004, 11:36 PM   #516
MikeW is offline MikeW  United States
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Default zen

I have built Zens 3-5 and will build 6. I built 3 different versions of the Alephs and am on my second AX. I am no Peter Daniel but I am getting better. I am learning along the way and enjoy the amps very much. I kind of hate to finish an amp, but love to start a new one. Thanks not only to Nelson but everyone in the forum.
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Old 13th February 2004, 11:38 PM   #517
Variac is offline Variac  Costa Rica
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But seriously, how do you know a priori that an XSOZ
In fact, it is one of the most popular Pass amps ever.
In fact some such as Henrik Stefano and Mad K say it's about as good as it gets....

When Nelson codifies a version of an amp in writing, we have a thoughtful standard to compare the other variations to. We also know that Mr. Pass has listened to it and it has a sound that intriges him even if he might prefer some other design for a specific purpose.

Fred- Nelson has stated that the crossover is a marginal product from a business point of view anyway. He HELPED Grey develop the xAleph. (keep that in mind Grataku) Your attacks on Grey are pathetic and self serving-give it a rest and us a break. In fact, Mr. Pass's published designs spell out every detail, they DON'T leave the details for us to work out. I can't work them out. I'm well aware you THINK you can and that everyone should have to do it your way- the hard way. Well, that's not Nelson's philosophy as much as you wish it so. He gives hints to people such as you and Grey in the beginning , then later (like right now with the SOX) he spells it out for the rest of us. If he was as concerned as you go on and on about regarding intellectual property being exposed on this site, why does he then publish them only a bit later?

I'm looking forward to Mr. Pass's opinion on the overall sound quality of the amp, whether it is really necessary to have a special preamp for his version, and a clear explaination inasmuch as it is possible about how the circuit works.

What's the point? Well you don't have to build every Zen amp, but if you read about each one there is a hell of an education therein. In fact, I just checked to see if the SOX was posted and ended up reading about the previous Zen- quite informative.


"The geek shall inherit the earth"
Burning Amp thread here on diyAudio
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Old 14th February 2004, 12:00 AM   #518
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One of the difficult aspects of electronics and circuit design is that seemingly inignificant changes in one place can cascade unexpected results throughout. One area where Nelson is unique and rare is his ability to take an aspect of circuit topology and relate it in a context where all other parts have a constancy such that the lesson can be learned without having to simultaneously think about a myriad of other issues.

We all know Nelson could have tossed us the final Zen version months or even years ago, but many of the subtleties in his lessons would be lost and the size of the audience who could follow the lessons would be greatly diminished. The Complementary Zen may not be an earth shattering advancement in audio circuitry design, but it is the clearest and most concise explanation of push-pull circuit design I've seen.

As well, the comparison of simple single ended (Original Zen) vs. simple balanced (SOZ) vs. simple push-pull (Complementary Zen) has provided the opportunity for identifying what the sound differences are between the various topologies. That alone was worth the price of admission.

So thank you Nelson for taking the long efforts to PASS it along in a way that provides the greatest impact and opportunity. (Couldn't help myself on the pun).
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Old 14th February 2004, 12:11 AM   #519
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You liked your pun so much, you posted it twice, didn't you?
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Old 14th February 2004, 12:35 AM   #520
jam is offline jam  United States
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Grataku and Variac,

It may be so that Mr.Pass helped Grey develop the Aleph-X, but have you asked yourself if Grey had the moral right to post it, after all it was Mr.Pass's design ( and intellectual property ) to begin with and is a current product,
unlike the Aleph. We all got got caught up in fervor of the moment but in hindsight it might not have been such a good thing and should have waited for Mr.Pass to publish it.

It is a privilage that Mr.Pass shares so much with us but please don't assume, for one moment, it is a right.

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