Balanced Zen v. Borbely SE Balanced

Pete Fleming · 1st June 2001, 11:16 PM

Here's another comparison request (don’t you just luv ‘em!)

I’m wondering if anyone has compared the Balanced Zen Line Stage, by Mr Nelson Pass, with the SE Balanced Line amp (EB-2000/402) by Mr Erno Borbely?

While I’m have an (increasing) admiration for the work of Nelson Pass, I am attracted to the idea of using JFETs instead of MOSFETS in a pre-amp. Indeed Mr Pass acknowledges the superiority of JFETs in certain low level applications.

Incidentally, to ascertain the performance of a “passive pre” in my system I soldered a couple of resistors in my interconnects as a voltage divider, and connected directly into my amp. Obviously I can’t alter the volume, however (as my CD player has two pairs of outputs) switching between the pre-amp and the attenuated leads demonstrated the affect of the pre-amp on the signal. Just a thought for those considering going down the passive path, but wanting to see the effects before spending a lot of money on a stepped attenuator. An alternative would be to make a series of “piggyback” RCA plugs of different values, with a female and male RCA connected via an attenuator.

Cheers,

Pete

jam · 3rd June 2001, 12:25 PM

Pete,

Both designs you mentioned are excellent, I have a slight preference for the Pass. I would current current source the circuit as suggested by Nelson(but try it both ways). The Borbely design, could be improved by replacing the follower, with for exmample, a single ended mosfet.

Have you considered using a shunt volume control?

Jam

Pete Fleming · 4th June 2001, 01:26 AM

While I like the idea of using JFETS, I haven't been able to easily locate the devices used in the Borbely design, so I think the Pass project will get the nod.

I'm designing the pre-amp as a modular concept so can easily replace the gain stage. I'm presently collecting data to use the same typology as the "Balanced Zen", except with JFETS.

Cheers,

Pete

jam · 4th June 2001, 01:42 AM

Pete,
The use of j-fets is probably not necessary as noise should not be a problem for the signal levels involved (they would be if you were building a phonostage).
Also you would need a buffer since j-fets might not handle the current levels required and you will be forced to use a follower.

Jam

Pete Fleming · 4th June 2001, 02:10 AM

Yes these were exactly the things I was looking at, just going through spec sheets to see if I could find something suitable.

Always worth pondering though.

Cheers,

Pete

UltimateX86 · 21st February 2005, 08:44 PM

!up

Bosoz with 30V rail vs Borbely SE Balanced ??

http://www.borbelyaudio.com/eb2000402.asp

thx

Nelson Pass · 21st February 2005, 10:28 PM

They're both nice circuits. Maybe you should
try both.

UltimateX86 · 22nd February 2005, 02:59 PM

hi

It is possible to use a symetric PS for pushpull ?

one could remove the output capacitor ....

or then to use an output like the kaneda

http://www.bonavolta.ch/hobby/en/audio/kaneda_p.htm

thx

4th June 2001, 01:26 AM	#3
Pete Fleming diyAudio Member Join Date: May 2001	Think Mr Pass will get the nod While I like the idea of using JFETS, I haven't been able to easily locate the devices used in the Borbely design, so I think the Pass project will get the nod. I'm designing the pre-amp as a modular concept so can easily replace the gain stage. I'm presently collecting data to use the same typology as the "Balanced Zen", except with JFETS. Cheers, Pete

4th June 2001, 02:10 AM	#5
Pete Fleming diyAudio Member Join Date: May 2001	Thanks for the heads up Yes these were exactly the things I was looking at, just going through spec sheets to see if I could find something suitable. Always worth pondering though. Cheers, Pete

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1st June 2001, 11:16 PM	#1
Pete Fleming diyAudio Member Join Date: May 2001	Here's another comparison request (don’t you just luv ‘em!) I’m wondering if anyone has compared the Balanced Zen Line Stage, by Mr Nelson Pass, with the SE Balanced Line amp (EB-2000/402) by Mr Erno Borbely? While I’m have an (increasing) admiration for the work of Nelson Pass, I am attracted to the idea of using JFETs instead of MOSFETS in a pre-amp. Indeed Mr Pass acknowledges the superiority of JFETs in certain low level applications. Incidentally, to ascertain the performance of a “passive pre” in my system I soldered a couple of resistors in my interconnects as a voltage divider, and connected directly into my amp. Obviously I can’t alter the volume, however (as my CD player has two pairs of outputs) switching between the pre-amp and the attenuated leads demonstrated the affect of the pre-amp on the signal. Just a thought for those considering going down the passive path, but wanting to see the effects before spending a lot of money on a stepped attenuator. An alternative would be to make a series of “piggyback” RCA plugs of different values, with a female and male RCA connected via an attenuator. Cheers, Pete

3rd June 2001, 12:25 PM	#2
jam diyAudio Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Charlotte,NC,USA	Pete, Both designs you mentioned are excellent, I have a slight preference for the Pass. I would current current source the circuit as suggested by Nelson(but try it both ways). The Borbely design, could be improved by replacing the follower, with for exmample, a single ended mosfet. Have you considered using a shunt volume control? Jam

4th June 2001, 01:42 AM	#4
jam diyAudio Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Charlotte,NC,USA	Pete, The use of j-fets is probably not necessary as noise should not be a problem for the signal levels involved (they would be if you were building a phonostage). Also you would need a buffer since j-fets might not handle the current levels required and you will be forced to use a follower. Jam

21st February 2005, 08:44 PM	#6
UltimateX86 diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: France	!up Bosoz with 30V rail vs Borbely SE Balanced ?? http://www.borbelyaudio.com/eb2000402.asp thx

21st February 2005, 10:28 PM	#7
Nelson Pass The one and only Join Date: Mar 2001	They're both nice circuits. Maybe you should try both.

22nd February 2005, 02:59 PM	#8
UltimateX86 diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: France	hi It is possible to use a symetric PS for pushpull ? one could remove the output capacitor .... or then to use an output like the kaneda http://www.bonavolta.ch/hobby/en/audio/kaneda_p.htm thx