To DIY, or OEM PASS? - Page 6 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Amplifiers > Pass Labs

Pass Labs This forum is dedicated to Pass Labs discussion.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 29th July 2012, 03:56 PM   #51
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
well. say the F5 CAN push 100W (it is very possible)
i cant see any difference from pushing the aleph4 in the same room with the same speakers. exept that the F5 will deliver more power on lowZ's.
so the F5 will do it better
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 03:58 PM   #52
diyAudio Member
 
KatieandDad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: UK
If you say so. I sold my F5 on E-Bay.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 04:53 PM   #53
The one and only
 
Nelson Pass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatieandDad View Post
If Nelson himself had produced the Nirvana of amps he wouldn't keep on trying to improve on his designs !!!!
Each design is Nirvana to somebody.

  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 05:03 PM   #54
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatieandDad View Post
At the time of my F5 I has some B&W 683's the F5 couldn't cope with them.

I've just won a pair of YELLOW (that's another story) B&W 802D's, the F5 certainly wouldn't like them.

The Aleph 4 copes well with both the 683s and the 802D's
K & D,

Thanks for this info - its very useful.

The 683's drop down to Z = |3.0| - I don't think an F5 is designed for this.

My preference with B&W's is tubes in the preamp and MOSFET's in the power amp.
- and solid core copper speaker cables.
- something to look into is solid core OCC copper with teflon insulation.
there are only 3 companies licensed to make OCC copper wire and its sold under quite a few brand names.

With my N804's - I'm thinking of bi amping with a small class A MOSFET amp going to the mid/tweeter
and a Bi polar push - pull amp going to the bass.

B&W has really improved the crossovers with their Diamond series.

In my 603 s2's and N804's they used Bennic resistors and MKP caps.
What were they thinking ?
I rebuilt the tweeter crossover section in my 603's and it was a huge improvement.

I suspect an Aleph 4 can drive the 802D's because of a very low Zout
and they can deliver lots of current.
.
.

Last edited by Uunderhill; 29th July 2012 at 05:08 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 05:08 PM   #55
diyAudio Member
 
buzzforb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Burlington, NC
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uunderhill View Post
K & D,

Thanks for this info - its very useful.

The 683's drop down to Z = |3.0| - I don't think an F5 is designed for this.

My preference with B&W's is tubes in the preamp and MOSFET's in the power amp.
- and solid core copper speaker cables.
- something to look into is solid core OCC copper with teflon insulation.
there are only 3 companies licensed to make OCC copper wire and its sold under quite a few brand names.

With my N804's - I'm thinking of bi amping with a small class A MOSFET amp going to the mid/tweeter
and a Bi polar push - pull amp going to the bass.

B&W has really improved the crossovers with their Diamond series.

In my 603 s2's and N804's they used Bennic resistors and MKP caps.
What were they thinking ?
I rebuilt the tweeter crossover section in my 603's and it was a huge improvement.
.
Uunderhill,
Have you read the F5 article? HAve you read the F5T article? K&D may not like the f5, but he is simply wrong about its abilities. If the standard F5 is not suited for your speakers, the F5T V2 or V3 will EASILY drive your speakers. You may not like it, but it isnt because it is having trouble doing the job. Be careful that you check what others say. BTW, he is comparing a 25W F5 to a 100W A4.
__________________
...Shape the sound , Man!

Last edited by buzzforb; 29th July 2012 at 05:11 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 05:09 PM   #56
diyAudio Member
 
sakellogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: dixon ill
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatieandDad View Post

If Nelson himself had produced the Nirvana of amps he wouldn't keep on trying to improve on his .
im going to have to dissagree. i may be overstepping my bounds by speaking for him but.....he has just as much fun diy as we do.
just like us, its fun to him. it just so happens hes one of the lucky ones who can pay the bills off his fun.
__________________
I'm not crazy, my mother had me tested
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 05:38 PM   #57
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSan View Post
i have 3-way scan-speak (88db 6ohm) wich is much harder load. and my F5 drive them very well
AudioSam,

I think what makes a speaker an easy load is the magnitude of the impedance curve and its phase angles.

Speakers with mostly a real impedance where Z >= |4 | ohms are a reasonable load to drive.

Speakers that have large phase angles - where there is a large rate of change in the phase angle
combined with a low Z magnitude - can be hell for an amp.

IMO an amp with a very low Zout - combined with a huge power supply - is needed for speakers like these.

I don't know which 3 way Scan Speak speakers you have,
but from what I've seen from Seas and Scan Speak designs,
the real and imaginary components of the impedance, provide a reasonable load.
Have is Troels Gravesen's builds of Scan Speak's - bless this person.
ScanSpeak Projects
.
.
.

Last edited by Uunderhill; 29th July 2012 at 05:45 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 05:58 PM   #58
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Unnderhill. my scan-speaks are my own design. based on the good old classic series.
2x8" bottom, 7"mid and 9500 tweeter.
the 8" drivers are custom 12ohm. not 8ohm as standar.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 06:15 PM   #59
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzforb View Post
Uunderhill,
Have you read the F5 article? HAve you read the F5T article? K&D may not like the f5, but he is simply wrong about its abilities. If the standard F5 is not suited for your speakers, the F5T V2 or V3 will EASILY drive your speakers. You may not like it, but it isnt because it is having trouble doing the job. Be careful that you check what others say. BTW, he is comparing a 25W F5 to a 100W A4.
I've tinkered modding the F5 for a few weeks now.

Mr. Pass, Juma and Zen Mod have been very kind to help me with the mods.

The F5 has some great advantages
- its dead quiet
- there is no thump with switch on and off
- Beethoven piano Trios and Mozart piano concerti sound great with it.
- sonically I really like this amp

From a Zout point of view, the F5 has a parallel common source output stage.
So I think its really intended for speakers that are reasonable load.
It drives my 10" 2528 DC Tannoys beautifully.


K&D has B&W's where the Z =< |3.0| , with difficult phase angles - these speakers put huge demands on an amp.

The aleph 4 has a follower output - so I suspect its Zout is very low.
Plus the power supply could run a fork lift.
.

Last edited by Uunderhill; 29th July 2012 at 06:17 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 07:00 PM   #60
diyAudio Member
 
buzzforb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Burlington, NC
If you compared an F5T rated at 100W like the F5T v3, you would find the differences, other than sound, to be minimal. The two amps, equally rated in power, will aoun different due to topology, not the ability to drive the speakers effectively.
__________________
...Shape the sound , Man!
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DIY One fader mixer with Filter Low Pass, Hi Pass, Notch Pass Filter PGM stevep314 Analog Line Level 0 10th August 2010 09:15 PM
DIY Low Pass and Mid/High Pass (Bass Blocking) Filters runslikealpaca Everything Else 1 19th June 2009 10:59 PM
OEM Digital Crossover now Available to Diy Market Daytona50 Swap Meet 16 16th January 2009 11:45 PM
Pass Diy High Low Pass Please macka Pass Labs 127 2nd March 2004 11:00 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:54 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2