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Old 19th January 2013, 05:52 PM   #3521
flocchini is offline flocchini  United States
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[QUOTE=buzzforb;3333165]
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Originally Posted by flocchini View Post
Flocchini,
What is the schematic that goes with the above?
If bottom Fet is seeing negative phase, then it means the top Fet needs higher yfs. To have higher k2 on positive phase.
Sorry - this is the schematic I was referencing
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Old 19th January 2013, 05:55 PM   #3522
generg is offline generg  Germany
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I am not sure, I did not mean absolute phase...

I meant the phase of k2...

or do I mix up something...?
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Old 19th January 2013, 07:15 PM   #3523
buzzforb is offline buzzforb  United States
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Originally Posted by generg View Post
I am not sure, I did not mean absolute phase...

I meant the phase of k2...

or do I mix up something...?

Another brick in the wall. Will fire up my copy of j2 today and see how it works out. Played with Visual last night some more. Will hook up F5T to test it out.
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Old 20th January 2013, 03:33 PM   #3524
generg is offline generg  Germany
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Hi folks,

I did some hearing with the negative phase for k2......like flocchini, whose hearing encouraged me to try it......most other comments on negative phase were more negative ...done mostly in the F5 and BBA-3 thread, when Nelson showed the pot over the source resistors first time.

I like it..... it adds more space to my (small) room and there is a kind of swirl when instruments color or tone changes around the instruments place. Ears have more to do and get more surprises.
The effect may be artificial, but worth a try!

And for all that yearned for a J2, never the similarity was closer!

It is not the same distinctness of higher tones, but the same sweetness and painting a huge stage.

I do not why, but now the similarity to my F3 clone is also much more higher.

I will still try to see the phase changes with the Visual Analyzer program directly.
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Old 20th January 2013, 04:02 PM   #3525
flocchini is offline flocchini  United States
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generg

Glad to hear you liked the neg phase - I was starting to wonder about my ears - I have the F3 on my high end so the combination with the F6 is extremely listenable.

Enjoy

Bob
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Old 20th January 2013, 04:07 PM   #3526
buzzforb is offline buzzforb  United States
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This means more degeneration up top, or less yfs on top, if usin gno degeneration, corect?
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Old 20th January 2013, 04:13 PM   #3527
generg is offline generg  Germany
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yes I think so!

But it seems a matter of taste, for some people prefer positive phase.....

like botte, look here...

Burning Amp BA-3

so it may be dependent on amp and speakers and room or taste.....
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Old 20th January 2013, 04:20 PM   #3528
Tea-Bag is offline Tea-Bag  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by generg View Post

It is not the same distinctness of higher tones, but the same sweetness and painting a huge stage.
It seems mine got a little darker. If that is what your saying. A little more fleshy. The soundstage of F6 is very good no matter what you do.....

I believe my setup the Q2 is close to 0R, and that Q1 is in the opposite direction. My tools for measuring are inadequate to make further recommendations.
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Old 20th January 2013, 04:24 PM   #3529
buzzforb is offline buzzforb  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by generg View Post
yes I think so!

But it seems a matter of taste, for some people prefer positive phase.....

like botte, look here...

Burning Amp BA-3

so it may be dependent on amp and speakers and room or taste.....
With my degeneration version, I ended up with top Rs bypassed with cap and lower fet with .15R of degeneration. Didnt go lower due to lack of resistors, but lower on the Rs always semmed to make me like it more. Matching fets and using lower yfs on top, may give best of both worlds. If this all related to absolute phase, I would think that the stronger fet would need to be on top in the J2 or have more degeneration on the lower fet. With it, though, there are other ways to set gain of cs.
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Old 20th January 2013, 04:53 PM   #3530
Botte is offline Botte  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by generg View Post
Hi folks,

I did some hearing with the negative phase for k2......like flocchini, whose hearing encouraged me to try it......most other comments on negative phase were more negative ...done mostly in the F5 and BBA-3 thread, when Nelson showed the pot over the source resistors first time.

I like it..... it adds more space to my (small) room and there is a kind of swirl when instruments color or tone changes around the instruments place. Ears have more to do and get more surprises.
The effect may be artificial, but worth a try!

And for all that yearned for a J2, never the similarity was closer!

It is not the same distinctness of higher tones, but the same sweetness and painting a huge stage.

I do not why, but now the similarity to my F3 clone is also much more higher.

I will still try to see the phase changes with the Visual Analyzer program directly.
I agree, negative phase second harmonic is a nice effect, and after a few days I missed the weight of the sound you do get from positive phase k2. I would say negative is more "hifi" and positive is more musical and has more long term enjoyment potential. Best of all it's easy to change, so try it both ways and report back. As always, just my opinion.
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