X-ing Zen V5?

[Netlist]

Is it possible to X the Zen V5?
I made a quick drawing on the sim and found the following.
At first impression a bridged Zen V5 works better than an X.
(Assuming the drawing is an X of course).

So could anyone tell if this is worth a study?

/Hugo

[Henrik]

Hi Netlist

I got the same idea, you need to add a diff pair like in the Aleph-X.

[nobody special]

At that point you're not far off from the regular X amp... Just use a differential pair, folded cascode with a VGS multiplier, and a follower output stage. Seems easier and probably better than using two cascaded common source stages- amounts to a single voltage amplification stage and a driver, with the differential pair shared for both halves (ready to add X feedback). I have simulated it, and it works well.

[Nelson Pass]

If you want to "X" ZV5, you would be looking to attach
the Source pins together in two identical ZV5's. Since
the circuit is phase inverting, the "cross" feedback is not
employed - it remains as with the ZV5 circuit - the communication
between the two halves occurs through the Source pins of
the gain devices.

Is this enough of a hint?

/

[Netlist]

Henrik,
I like your approach but it reminds me too much of the AlephX.

Steve,
I'm afraid I only understand half of what you want to explain

Nelson,
I haven't got a clue...for the moment but maybe others will

/Hugo - time and much imagination will tell...

[Netlist]

This is my (after a good sleep) interpretation of
"attaching the Source pins together".
The technique reminds me of the magic resistor in the Monolithic Supersymmetry thread.
However, the value of these R’s has to be much higher: around 10 to 20k.
Any input welcome
/Hugo

[jh6you]

I would try this concept.

[nobody special]

Netlist,
This is a conceptual schematic of what I was talking about. Funny thing about it is that after throwing it together and guessing at the values, I ran the simulation and it worked! 130 watts or so into 8 ohms.
This is only my interpretation of the p-p X amps. In reading about the real thing, I found that Nelson dosen't use feedback around the output stage, so this obviously isn't what he is doing exactly. But, it seems to work, and it's something to look at and think about.
Obviously, when it comes to all of this stuff, it is better to listen to the man himself, than to someone like me who is only beginning to understand the concepts on some basic level. I just thought it was interesting, for the sake of discussion.

[Netlist]

That's a nice approach, JH.
Your circuit seems to perform quite a bit better than mine except for the harmonic distortion figures.
Again, I have no idea if we're on the right track.
Seeing your design gives me the feeling we are.

Steve
I already simulated your followers yesterday, in silence..of course.
Indeed quite a powerful amp.
I have to take a more in-dept look at it.
Is your last schematic meant to be an X?

Meanwhile the Zen-virus got us again.
Thanks Nelson.

/Hugo

[nobody special]

Yes, it's a push-pull X. Let me know what your sim comes up with (on the followers, that is). I would like to find a way to increase the input impedance of that circuit. It would also be nice to find a way to direct couple the input. Any ideas?