Balanced F5 question - Page 69

massimo · 10th December 2010, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horio

When I click the first link, I'm seeing a 25V 22uF TS-HA Cap. Shows an operating temp up to 105C with a 30mm diameter. You sure you aren't looking at the 35V TS-HA?

DOH!
You're right! 1st link TSHA 22mF/25V d 30mm, 2nd link TS-UP 22mF/35V d 30mm (same value but TS-HA d 35mm I have some pieces on my desk)

EUVL · 02:54 AM

Sometimes it's worth looking carefully first.

There is no reason to have to have TS-HA.
Some 85°C caps lives very long, unless you are listening to music over 8 hours everyday.
And the two ends of the heatsink are hardly over 50°C, near to which is the caps are placed, to the immediate left & right of the main PCB.

Take a look at the lifetime specified for e.g. Vishay BC 056 series (85°C) :

VISHAY BC COMPONENTS|2222 056 46223.|CAPACITOR, 22000UF 25V | Farnell United Kingdom
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/15301.pdf

"Useful life 85°C 12000 hrs."
"Useful life 40°C 210000 hrs."

For EPCOS, you may choose B41231A5339M000 :
https://www.buerklin.com/datenblaetter/D097790_TD.pdf
http://www2.mouser.com/ProductDetail...zkPvoelrzp0%3d

which is 33000uF and has one of the highest ripple current at 120Hz that I have seen for that size.

Patrick

.

EUVL · 11th December 2010, 08:48 AM

The above link to Mouser is incorrect (wrong voltage).
This is the correct one :

EPCOS|B41231A5339M000|KONDENSATOR,SNAP-IN,25V,33000UF | Farnell Deutschland

Patrick

EUVL · 11th December 2010, 09:11 AM

At a glance.
Feel free to propose more alternatives.

Patrick

Melon Head · 07:45 PM

Nippon Chemicon KMH
EKMH250VSN223MR45S
Ripple Current 4.04A at 105 degrees C

tinitus · 11th December 2010, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EUVL

"Useful life 85°C 12000 hrs."
"Useful life 40°C 210000 hrs."

question is, are 105 C any better than 85 C, if temperature stays below 60 C at all times

but BC 105 C have slightly larger diameter than 85 C

are they double shielded, or is it because they hold more electrolytic, or both ?
is it about cooling, or purely chemical, or both ?

EUVL · 11th December 2010, 07:51 PM

Digi-Key - 565-2861-ND (Manufacturer - EKMH250VSN223MR45T)
Ripple current 4.04A.

Patrick

EUVL · 11th December 2010, 07:53 PM

I have good experience with BC 056, so I would not hesistate to use them again.
But on pure spec., the EPCOS is quite impressive. And it is 33000uF.

Patrick

Melon Head · 12th December 2010, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tinitus

question is, are 105 C any better than 85 C, if temperature stays below 60 C at all times

but BC 105 C have slightly larger diameter than 85 C

are they double shielded, or is it because they hold more electrolytic, or both ?
is it about cooling, or purely chemical, or both ?

My friends that work at boeing, say "never use 85 degree caps for power supplies". They are constantly pulling out failed 85 degree caps and replacing them with 105 degree parts.
They have never had to replace a 105 degree rated cap (except in the case where the caps were over 20 years old).

The rated capacitance also tends to drop more with heat in the 85 degree parts.

If you can get them cheap I wouldn't hesitate in using them but if the price difference is small go for the 105 degree parts.

EUVL · 12th December 2010, 10:27 PM

Doesn't that depends on the temperature that the caps will see in its service ?

For industrial applications (e.g. automotive) where 80°C ambient is not unusual, I can image that it makes a real difference.
But in our case, it hardly sees 55°C ....

Anyway, plenty of choices for the same standard size.

Patrick

11th December 2010, 02:48 AM	#682
EUVL diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2003	Sometimes it's worth looking carefully first. There is no reason to have to have TS-HA. Some 85°C caps lives very long, unless you are listening to music over 8 hours everyday. And the two ends of the heatsink are hardly over 50°C, near to which is the caps are placed, to the immediate left & right of the main PCB. Take a look at the lifetime specified for e.g. Vishay BC 056 series (85°C) : VISHAY BC COMPONENTS\|2222 056 46223.\|CAPACITOR, 22000UF 25V \| Farnell United Kingdom http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/15301.pdf "Useful life 85°C 12000 hrs." "Useful life 40°C 210000 hrs." For EPCOS, you may choose B41231A5339M000 : https://www.buerklin.com/datenblaetter/D097790_TD.pdf http://www2.mouser.com/ProductDetail...zkPvoelrzp0%3d which is 33000uF and has one of the highest ripple current at 120Hz that I have seen for that size. Patrick . Last edited by EUVL; 11th December 2010 at 02:54 AM.

11th December 2010, 07:36 PM	#685
Melon Head Banned Join Date: Nov 2006	Nippon Chemicon KMH EKMH250VSN223MR45S Ripple Current 4.04A at 105 degrees C Last edited by Melon Head; 11th December 2010 at 07:45 PM.

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11th December 2010, 08:48 AM	#683
EUVL diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2003	The above link to Mouser is incorrect (wrong voltage). This is the correct one : EPCOS\|B41231A5339M000\|KONDENSATOR,SNAP-IN,25V,33000UF \| Farnell Deutschland Patrick

11th December 2010, 07:51 PM	#687
EUVL diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2003	Digi-Key - 565-2861-ND (Manufacturer - EKMH250VSN223MR45T) Ripple current 4.04A. Patrick

11th December 2010, 07:53 PM	#688
EUVL diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2003	I have good experience with BC 056, so I would not hesistate to use them again. But on pure spec., the EPCOS is quite impressive. And it is 33000uF. Patrick

12th December 2010, 10:27 PM	#690
EUVL diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2003	Doesn't that depends on the temperature that the caps will see in its service ? For industrial applications (e.g. automotive) where 80°C ambient is not unusual, I can image that it makes a real difference. But in our case, it hardly sees 55°C .... Anyway, plenty of choices for the same standard size. Patrick