I've liked the idea of putting together one of these big glorious silly beasts for some time now. Built around the standard size (at 18mm MDF) it'd be just small enough to be constructed outside and then moved into the room through the door. But I'm musing on the idea of scaling up the size to the biggest I could get away with in the room and building it in situ. I already have a big silly pair of 'stats and figure that with a big horn, why not go as big as I can get away with?
Some quick back of the envelope maths using the 96" length of an MDF panel as the height gives a scale mutiplier of 1.333 from the 72" stock (and thus a side scale to 31") which gives an assembled raising tilt of just over 100" (side hypotenuse) and my ceiling is about 112" so building a pair using full MDF panels would, physically at least, be possible (weight considerations would become the next issue as the stock design works out at about 90KG per speaker. So I'd recon on at least doubling that with an 8 foot version).
What I don't know is if this kind of scale up would be inadvisable in terms of sound. Digitalmind logged here a while back his adventures with the J-Low slimmed down in width and seemed happy with the results. I would keep the proportions the same. And with the proportions the same, the scope of the horn is the same. I'd plan on sticking with the Jordan drivers.
Basically, I want to do something big, but with a simple build. Which is why I thought about scaling up the J-Low rather than scaling down the Kleinhorn.
Thoughts from you fine chaps?
Some quick back of the envelope maths using the 96" length of an MDF panel as the height gives a scale mutiplier of 1.333 from the 72" stock (and thus a side scale to 31") which gives an assembled raising tilt of just over 100" (side hypotenuse) and my ceiling is about 112" so building a pair using full MDF panels would, physically at least, be possible (weight considerations would become the next issue as the stock design works out at about 90KG per speaker. So I'd recon on at least doubling that with an 8 foot version).
What I don't know is if this kind of scale up would be inadvisable in terms of sound. Digitalmind logged here a while back his adventures with the J-Low slimmed down in width and seemed happy with the results. I would keep the proportions the same. And with the proportions the same, the scope of the horn is the same. I'd plan on sticking with the Jordan drivers.
Basically, I want to do something big, but with a simple build. Which is why I thought about scaling up the J-Low rather than scaling down the Kleinhorn.
Thoughts from you fine chaps?
That looks very cool. Let me be clear where my twisted little mind has me going with this notion. The speakers will have to go into the corners of the room. I would push my 'stats back to listen to them.
The room is approx 15 feet long and 12.5 feet wide with a 9.5 foot ceiling.
I don't have the tooling to manufacture anything structurally complex.
Whatever comes together should serve as a complimentary alternative to a pair of 'stats. I don't want anything which sounds "polite".
Cheaper is better (isn't it always).
Bigger is better (within reason).
My apologies for sounding like a spoonfed idiot. Which I am.
The room is approx 15 feet long and 12.5 feet wide with a 9.5 foot ceiling.
I don't have the tooling to manufacture anything structurally complex.
Whatever comes together should serve as a complimentary alternative to a pair of 'stats. I don't want anything which sounds "polite".
Cheaper is better (isn't it always).
Bigger is better (within reason).
My apologies for sounding like a spoonfed idiot. Which I am.
full blast A7 Altec cab (VoT ) ( I know at least one Mod here , beside my self 
who's bllody nutz about everything Altec )
or VoT bass cab + Edgar for mid + whatever for high
or VoT + EWG ( ask Zilch at AudioKarma or here )
or Mighty KH , with better mid horn and funny ATP80 Selenium tweet
or whatever , but at least 12" for bass
15W will rock the house
who's bllody nutz about everything Altec )or VoT bass cab + Edgar for mid + whatever for high
or VoT + EWG ( ask Zilch at AudioKarma or here )
or Mighty KH , with better mid horn and funny ATP80 Selenium tweet
or whatever , but at least 12" for bass
15W will rock the house
I hate to sound like an idiot, but could you break down those abbrvs and acronyms for me? My searches are throwing up results which don't take me places very well. And I feel like a fool. But from post context, if you're referring to something along the lines of a big Altec cabinet speaker, circumstance would have it I may be getting ahold of a pair needing restoration next month. Model not certain yet.
Id also prefer a single-driver build. But I'll read and bend.
Id also prefer a single-driver build. But I'll read and bend.
ATP80? Is there such a thing? Selenium??? I can't find.
APT80 perhaps? Eminence (AP50 + 80deg conical horn).
Selenium's ST320 slot tweeter doesn't exactly suck...
Nosireebob, it does not. Meets all funny requirements
for post obfuscation too. I can abbreviate that down
to an anacronym if it helps...
Down low, I'd take an exponentially slotted waveguide.
IE: 1955 Karlson K15 scaled up for an 18. Its kinda like
a horn, except it isn't... And would fit through the door.
I got no special midrange opinions at this time. Except
that I'd probably slot the front to match the dispersion
of the top and bottom.
This is probably a lot wider than 90deg, if wall echos
are considered a bad thing, pattern control offered by
true horns might be your only option. But things get
crazy big in no time... I'd rather just pad the walls.
APT80 perhaps? Eminence (AP50 + 80deg conical horn).
Selenium's ST320 slot tweeter doesn't exactly suck...
Nosireebob, it does not. Meets all funny requirements
for post obfuscation too. I can abbreviate that down
to an anacronym if it helps...
Down low, I'd take an exponentially slotted waveguide.
IE: 1955 Karlson K15 scaled up for an 18. Its kinda like
a horn, except it isn't... And would fit through the door.
I got no special midrange opinions at this time. Except
that I'd probably slot the front to match the dispersion
of the top and bottom.
This is probably a lot wider than 90deg, if wall echos
are considered a bad thing, pattern control offered by
true horns might be your only option. But things get
crazy big in no time... I'd rather just pad the walls.
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ALtec A7 or whatever - is 15" in reflex/front loaded horn hybrid cab
mated with 811B or 511B horns on top
KH means Klipsch Horn , usually meaning on big - Klipsch Korner Horn - 15" in bass horn , then squawker horn , then tweet horn
my mistake - I meant on APT80 , and Ken got it well
regarding EconoWave Guide - go to AudioKarma forum , and read ; it will be fun , fer sure . its' cheap JBL plastic "horn" , mated with 50$ Selenium D220Ti compression driver -best thing after bread ....... at least in sub-3zero price tag range
mated with 811B or 511B horns on top
KH means Klipsch Horn , usually meaning on big - Klipsch Korner Horn - 15" in bass horn , then squawker horn , then tweet horn
my mistake - I meant on APT80 , and Ken got it well
regarding EconoWave Guide - go to AudioKarma forum , and read ; it will be fun , fer sure . its' cheap JBL plastic "horn" , mated with 50$ Selenium D220Ti compression driver -best thing after bread ....... at least in sub-3zero price tag range
another place to look for tips tricks and help :
Pi Speakers - unmatched quality and state-of-the-art performance
da Man know his drek !
Pi Speakers - unmatched quality and state-of-the-art performance
da Man know his drek !
I saw Wayne today (in Dallas). This time round, his drek was spot on, best of show IMHO.
Loudspeakerwize anyways... I saw other guy's amps what theoreticaly should have been
better'n his, but hooked to such goofy speakers it was hard to tell the amplifier's merit.
Wayne's drek didn't look special today (4pi?) except a strange new woofer, I think he just
had his overall system dialed in perfect. The sound was awesome beyond its appearance.
I head some low frequency content in a Floyd track I'd never before known was there,
and it wasn't annoying or blown out of proportion. Really sounded like it all belonged.
Last year same show, Pi drek was just drek... Couldn't figure what the fuss was about?
The challenge of dragging stuff to a cramped hotel room and try to make it sound right?
Though it was much worse for those who brought big horns...
Loudspeakerwize anyways... I saw other guy's amps what theoreticaly should have been
better'n his, but hooked to such goofy speakers it was hard to tell the amplifier's merit.
Wayne's drek didn't look special today (4pi?) except a strange new woofer, I think he just
had his overall system dialed in perfect. The sound was awesome beyond its appearance.
I head some low frequency content in a Floyd track I'd never before known was there,
and it wasn't annoying or blown out of proportion. Really sounded like it all belonged.
Last year same show, Pi drek was just drek... Couldn't figure what the fuss was about?
The challenge of dragging stuff to a cramped hotel room and try to make it sound right?
Though it was much worse for those who brought big horns...
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was this what Wayne used in those pretty boxes? AE Speakers --- Superb Quality, Unforgettable Performance, Definitely. - we oughta pick up an AE for a 2-way Karlson project with slotted tube HF - which one?
Yeah verily, from the looks of that aluminum missile nose-cone, that be it...
Skrew slotted tube, get you the ST324 slotted horn, cheap won't regret.
Slap one in the right or left wing, similar dispersion without HF reverbs...
I misquoted "ST320" earlier, after makin fun of Zenmod misquoting APT80.
Figures how I would expand upon my own idiocy...
It occurs to me that Wayne had to be crossing in the middle of the vocal
range with that 2way? All the more amazing he did so without making an
audible mess of the crossing. KTube or slot-tweet, crossing in the vocals
might be your biggest nightmare. Can't ask either to cross low enough,
nor those AE's to cross high enough...
The AE was amazing, as-if anyone could afford them... I certainly can't.
I'm already on ramen noodles and had to skate out of a situation where
was feeling pressured to buy some thick felt surround for dome tweeters.
My wallet saved me be'in empty, and so I bailed to find the cash machine.
Then couldn't bear to go back and spend a whole $29 just for some felt...
I'm sure it was really good felt too. Not like smelly used carpet underlay,
which is what I'll have to settle for now....
Skrew slotted tube, get you the ST324 slotted horn, cheap won't regret.
Slap one in the right or left wing, similar dispersion without HF reverbs...
I misquoted "ST320" earlier, after makin fun of Zenmod misquoting APT80.
Figures how I would expand upon my own idiocy...
It occurs to me that Wayne had to be crossing in the middle of the vocal
range with that 2way? All the more amazing he did so without making an
audible mess of the crossing. KTube or slot-tweet, crossing in the vocals
might be your biggest nightmare. Can't ask either to cross low enough,
nor those AE's to cross high enough...
The AE was amazing, as-if anyone could afford them... I certainly can't.
I'm already on ramen noodles and had to skate out of a situation where
was feeling pressured to buy some thick felt surround for dome tweeters.
My wallet saved me be'in empty, and so I bailed to find the cash machine.
Then couldn't bear to go back and spend a whole $29 just for some felt...
I'm sure it was really good felt too. Not like smelly used carpet underlay,
which is what I'll have to settle for now....
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