Aleph 30 transformer hum

Heiney9 · 18th March 2010, 04:11 PM

I have a commercial (as opposed to DIY) Aleph 30. Recently I've noticed a transformer hum at both the speaker level and now I can hear it inside the chassis. Inside the chassis it seems to come and go in "waves" as it will get louder and softer as if it's cycling.

I recently had the amp plugged into a power conditioner which also regulates voltage and now I have it plugged directly into the wall and no change. I do use a tube pre-amp and thought that could possibly be the issue but even with the pre-amp off and outputs unplugged I still get the hum.

A very slight hum has been there since I bought it (used) but as the amp warmed up it used to go away almost completely, now it's constant and I can hear it through the speakers when sitting approximately 6-7' away. In addition to the actual transformer hum inside the chassis.

Any ideas? Is this a known issue? Do I need to send it into Pass Labs for a check up?

Thanks In Advance for any input

-Brock

tiefbassuebertr · 18th March 2010, 08:38 PM

check out this:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid...t-right-5.html
and
PLITRON - audio transformers - toroidal transformers - toroids - output transformers - current transformers - power transformers - medical isolation transformers - power toroids
also this article is very interesting:
Measuring Acoustic Noise Emitted by Power Transformers
Menno van der Veen, Consultant, Zwolle, The Netherlands; and Francisco de Leon, Brian Gladstone, and Valeriu Tatu, Plitron Manufacturing Inc., Toronto, Ontario
you can order it about
Audio Engineering Society (AES)
or about
http://www.plitron.com

roscoeiii · 18th March 2010, 11:11 PM

I had some toroid hum in my FirstWatt F1 which was due to DC on my crappy AC lines. To the best of my knowledge, most power conditioners do not remove this (and mine certainly didn't!). But there are 2 commercially available products that can take care of the problem of toroid hum if it is DC causing this. One is the PS Audio Humbuster (which I use now). The other is the Channel Islands XDC-2. I believe both companies also have 30 day trial periods, so if that's not the problem no big loss (except shipping).

Best of luck. I know the toroid hum drove me nuts (well nutsier)

h_a · 19th March 2010, 08:11 AM

Uh?

If a power conditioner does not remove DC, it is not worth the name...

Transformers age and mechanical humm becomes louder. The humm from the speakers is a different story and may be related to aged caps. A hint for that would also be that the humm went away after some time previously. Anyway, it would not hurt to replace the caps after 10 years of use.

Have fun, Hannes

roscoeiii · 19th March 2010, 01:34 PM

Hannes,

From my understanding, and from talking to folks at both PS Audio, Channel Islands and makers and sellers of other power conditioner, most power conditioners do not remove DC. I haven't had a stream of power conditioners through my system, but consensus among the folks I have talked to and inquired if their power conditioner treated the problem was that this is not a feature of power conditioners more generally.

h_a · 19th March 2010, 02:28 PM

Then what it's good for?

roscoeiii · 19th March 2010, 02:31 PM

There are many other ways that cleaning up power that will improve the sound of a system. And by the small number of products available that remove DC, it (and the associated toroid hum) may be a fairly uncommon problem. Numerous reviews of power conditioners can attest to how they may affect the sound (usually positively, though there are some downsides as well for certain types of conditioners with certain types of components).

tiefbassuebertr · 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roscoeiii

I had some toroid hum in my FirstWatt F1 which was due to DC on my crappy AC lines. To the best of my knowledge, most power conditioners do not remove this (and mine certainly didn't!). But there are 2 commercially available products that can take care of the problem of toroid hum if it is DC causing this. One is the PS Audio Humbuster (which I use now). The other is the Channel Islands XDC-2. I believe both companies also have 30 day trial periods, so if that's not the problem no big loss (except shipping).
Best of luck. I know the toroid hum drove me nuts (well nutsier)

I don't understand this term because I am not an english man: "well nutsier"
also not after read this:
Nutsier

In the attachement you will find some informations concerning the reasons for toroid hum

roscoeiii · 22nd March 2010, 06:37 PM

Ah, sorry. "nutsier" meant that it drove me more nuts (meaning crazier than I already am)

Heiney9 · 23rd March 2010, 08:27 PM

Thanks for the help so far..............and I don't know of a single std power conditioner until you get into power regenerators that filter DC from the line. PS Audio makes a UPC200HB that is their standard power cond. w/their humbuster product built in the same unit.

My concern is why the hum/buzz through the speakers........that leads me to believe it's an equipment issue not line issue.

18th March 2010, 04:11 PM	#1
Heiney9 diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: MidWest	Aleph 30 transformer hum I have a commercial (as opposed to DIY) Aleph 30. Recently I've noticed a transformer hum at both the speaker level and now I can hear it inside the chassis. Inside the chassis it seems to come and go in "waves" as it will get louder and softer as if it's cycling. I recently had the amp plugged into a power conditioner which also regulates voltage and now I have it plugged directly into the wall and no change. I do use a tube pre-amp and thought that could possibly be the issue but even with the pre-amp off and outputs unplugged I still get the hum. A very slight hum has been there since I bought it (used) but as the amp warmed up it used to go away almost completely, now it's constant and I can hear it through the speakers when sitting approximately 6-7' away. In addition to the actual transformer hum inside the chassis. Any ideas? Is this a known issue? Do I need to send it into Pass Labs for a check up? Thanks In Advance for any input -Brock

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18th March 2010, 08:38 PM	#2
tiefbassuebertr diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: D-55629 Schwarzerden	check out this: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid...t-right-5.html and PLITRON - audio transformers - toroidal transformers - toroids - output transformers - current transformers - power transformers - medical isolation transformers - power toroids also this article is very interesting: Measuring Acoustic Noise Emitted by Power Transformers Menno van der Veen, Consultant, Zwolle, The Netherlands; and Francisco de Leon, Brian Gladstone, and Valeriu Tatu, Plitron Manufacturing Inc., Toronto, Ontario you can order it about Audio Engineering Society (AES) or about http://www.plitron.com

18th March 2010, 11:11 PM	#3
roscoeiii diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2008	I had some toroid hum in my FirstWatt F1 which was due to DC on my crappy AC lines. To the best of my knowledge, most power conditioners do not remove this (and mine certainly didn't!). But there are 2 commercially available products that can take care of the problem of toroid hum if it is DC causing this. One is the PS Audio Humbuster (which I use now). The other is the Channel Islands XDC-2. I believe both companies also have 30 day trial periods, so if that's not the problem no big loss (except shipping). Best of luck. I know the toroid hum drove me nuts (well nutsier)

19th March 2010, 08:11 AM	#4
h_a diyAudio Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Graz, Austria	Uh? If a power conditioner does not remove DC, it is not worth the name... Transformers age and mechanical humm becomes louder. The humm from the speakers is a different story and may be related to aged caps. A hint for that would also be that the humm went away after some time previously. Anyway, it would not hurt to replace the caps after 10 years of use. Have fun, Hannes

19th March 2010, 01:34 PM	#5
roscoeiii diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2008	Hannes, From my understanding, and from talking to folks at both PS Audio, Channel Islands and makers and sellers of other power conditioner, most power conditioners do not remove DC. I haven't had a stream of power conditioners through my system, but consensus among the folks I have talked to and inquired if their power conditioner treated the problem was that this is not a feature of power conditioners more generally.

19th March 2010, 02:28 PM	#6
h_a diyAudio Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Graz, Austria	Then what it's good for?

19th March 2010, 02:31 PM	#7
roscoeiii diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2008	There are many other ways that cleaning up power that will improve the sound of a system. And by the small number of products available that remove DC, it (and the associated toroid hum) may be a fairly uncommon problem. Numerous reviews of power conditioners can attest to how they may affect the sound (usually positively, though there are some downsides as well for certain types of conditioners with certain types of components).

22nd March 2010, 06:37 PM	#9
roscoeiii diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2008	Ah, sorry. "nutsier" meant that it drove me more nuts (meaning crazier than I already am)

23rd March 2010, 08:27 PM	#10
Heiney9 diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: MidWest	Thanks for the help so far..............and I don't know of a single std power conditioner until you get into power regenerators that filter DC from the line. PS Audio makes a UPC200HB that is their standard power cond. w/their humbuster product built in the same unit. My concern is why the hum/buzz through the speakers........that leads me to believe it's an equipment issue not line issue.