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-   -   Aleph 30's with low sensitivity bookshelf speakers?? (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/pass-labs/125957-aleph-30s-low-sensitivity-bookshelf-speakers.html)

spzzzzkt 6th July 2008 11:56 PM

Aleph 30's with low sensitivity bookshelf speakers??
 
Hi All,

I'm looking at building a set of bookshelf speakers to run with a pair of Aleph30 monoblocks and have been considering something along the lines of Tony Gee's Hatt-SE http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/HATT-SE.html or Troel's Gravesen's Super-mini monitors http://www.troelsgravesen.dk/W15.htm . I'm a bit concerned about the low sensitivity of these designs at around 82-83dB and was wondering if anyone had experience using these (or similar) designs with the Aleph 30's?


cheers
Paul

Zen Mod 7th July 2008 12:06 AM

bookshelf spks - that means limited bass xtension , but also limited max SPL , so more than few things are already compromised ;

in overall picture - you'll hardly find A30 as weak link , in any way .....

I drove some LS3/5-like spks with 25W/ch tube amp ( EL34 in triode PP) and was pleased and thrilled ;

A30 can't be much worse :clown:

spzzzzkt 7th July 2008 03:00 AM

Zen Mod...

good points!! living in an apartment with neighbors in close proximity, full bass extension becomes a negative unfortunately. I found a review of the Hatt MkII paired with a diy A40 to good effect, so I'd guess the A30's should play reasonably nicely.

http://www.facstaff.bucknell.edu/esa...s/a40hatt.html


cheers
Paul

Peppe 7th July 2008 07:25 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally posted by Zen Mod

A30 can't be much worse :clown:

Picture more than words. :cool:

Bottom shelf from the left:

A30 + Pearl Phono + Aleph P 1.7 (work in progress :))

Speakers: Kef Ls 3/5a Last Edition (82.5 dB - 11 Ohm)

My room is very small and SPL enough for me. ;)

Cheers
Peppe

Buhl 7th July 2008 08:40 AM

How much is enough?
 
Hi Paul
SPL and volume are tricky things - in one way it's very subjective, and in another way it is not - 98 dB is 98dB - some people think it's sufficient for listening - others do not... You will probably have to build and test for yourself.

However, from my experience with Zen4 (25 watt/chn.) and a pair of proac 2.5 clones at about 87dB small class a amps can sound bigger than they are. I suspect two things to be the cause of that - one can be the type of distortion, equal order harmonics is said to sound more ear friendly than the uneven ones. Zen and aleph is single ended = equal order.

Then there are the powersupply - my zen has a 750 VA transformer and 126000uF - and it never sounds like its running out of steam like normal amps do - and start to distort - it just refuses to play any louder. My 25 watt gainclone acts completely different and will distort in a totally different way. It also seems weeker - it can't play just as loud, and - most importantly, the stereo image collapses quite fast when the small 25 watt amp is driven hard. The zen never looses control the same way (large PSU?) - and thus you can play louder and still live with the sound..,

Cheers and happy building!
Hans

jacco vermeulen 7th July 2008 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zen Mod
bookshelf spks - that means limited bass xtension , but also limited max SPL
But an easy and perfect combination with a rational power level Aleph.

All the BBC/Kef/Harbeth/Rogers clones and lookalikes have a minimum impedance that does not reach lower than 5.5 to 6 Ohms.
In my experience, you don't need that much peak SPL for a normal listening level, not even in a room that is a bit larger than average.
A clean 95dB is preferable to 105dB of high distortion levels.

The real downside of the Brit encyclopedia holders is the top notch power amp they require, my conclusion anyway with the Rogers LS3/5 in the mid 80s.
Only tube power amp i tried in those days that made them sing was the Lectron Jean Hiraga 50 Watter, same same for all the DIY 3/5 clone designs.
Shelling out $1800 for a set of LS3/5 and $3500 for a JH50 is not exactly economics for a lunch box LSP system, so the 3/5 and me went separate ways.
Which is where the Aleph enters, the 30W design is just about the best partner for these LSPs, a DIY gourmand a la carte dinner for a consumer grade bill.
Very nice LSP stands and good show, Peppe.

Peppe 7th July 2008 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jacco vermeulen

Very nice LSP stands and good show, Peppe.

Thanks Jacco :blush:

(If you remember) The A30 was my first DIY project since ever.

On the middle shelf you can see a BOZ (not made by me)
and a Headphone amp ZEN-like (schematic by Tortello).

BTW: The stands are made by Sicilian marble :cheerful:

Cheers
Peppe

Zen Mod 7th July 2008 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jacco vermeulen


......
Only tube power amp i tried in those days that made them sing was the Lectron Jean Hiraga 50 Watter, same same for all the DIY 3/5 clone designs.........


conclusion - you tried all sissy toob amps , except that one ...... which wasn't sissy :devily:

jacco vermeulen 7th July 2008 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Peppe
Sicilian marble
I didn't expect it to be plastic.

An Italian friend/collegue of mine imported the stuff himself, his entire home was white Sicilian marble at the time i visited his place.
Kitchen/bathrooms, the works, wall-to-wall, beautiful stuff.
Edit : damn, i recall also telling that story 2 years ago, shoot me.

Luigi the nut has a wife who works for the railroad company, means free train travelling abroad. Each summer he strippes/stripped the interior of his Fiat and loaded it with empty wine bottles, after the annual family visit the Rosso filled vehicle was driven back on a car train.
Usually, the suspension of his Fiat was totally shot after the home return travel. :clown:

The CJ EVO2K was a nice half-valve amp in that era, different league though, 3 times the JH50 tag. Loved the Jadis stuff, but same story there.

Peppe 7th July 2008 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jacco vermeulen


I didn't expect it to be plastic.

Why not? :clown:

I like it, but I have to say that is one of the cheapest marble I can find.

Quote:


Edit : damn, i recall also telling that story 2 years ago, shoot me.

Mmm, It sound familiar to me as well.... :yes:

My stands got 2 years as well :D

Quote:


Usually, the suspension of his Fiat was totally shot after the home return travel. :clown:

Does not exist FIAT cars as in that time.... :cool:


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