PCB programs

[Christer]

Problem solved. It seems I had changed some option which I have no idea what it is supposed to do, or what the default value should be. A manual or at least some elementary help is badly needed for this program, but it is hard to complain about such things for freeware.

[acenovelty]

Hmm,

Sounds like you're trying to use Pcbnew.exe.

On the top left side of the program window, under where you see the white box with "track xx.x" is an icon with what looks like a magnifying glass and a red check mark is what's called the DRC. Click it to change to the "on" state. Now you can draw a trace anywhere on the page.
The start up value is always "off". So you must set it every time you start the program.

If you downloaded the entire program for Windoz, there is a help manual for every program under the heading Help. Admittedly it is more than somewhat lacking in detail. Things like ending a track where you want, making a bounding box, deleting unwanted traces or parts, adding text, moving a placed part, copying, flipping, rotating, whole blocks and on and on. Remember to check out what the right mouse click does for many functions.

For instance, find the add tracks icon on the right side of the window.

Right click and you can now set trace width, vias etc. Now draw a trace any length by left click and move the mouse. When you get to where you want, release the left click and now right click to open up a new dialog box with choices. This is the method for many functions.

Kicad has a serious learning curve, maybe a steep one for many folks. I found most other pcb creation software also has a learning curve and few are intuitive. At least IMHO.

The price is right for many people. But your time is also important and has a real value. My granpa always said, "Nothing succeeds like perseverance". Followed by "Gitr done boy.".

HTH without discouraging too much.

[Christer]

Originally posted by acenovelty

On the top left side of the program window, under where you see the white box with "track xx.x" is an icon with what looks like a magnifying glass and a red check mark is what's called the DRC. Click it to change to the "on" state. Now you can draw a trace anywhere on the page.
The start up value is always "off". So you must set it every time you start the program.

DRC was the problem. As I noted in my second post, I eventually found the problem by trying to switch various options on and off to see if any of them made a difference. I suppose DRC serves a purpose, but it is very confusing since it is still possible to lay tracks, just very restricted. If it turned off track laying entirely it would have been easier to realize that some mode or option must be wrong.

If you downloaded the entire program for Windoz, there is a help manual for every program under the heading Help. Admittedly it is more than somewhat lacking in detail.

Yes, I know, but it didn't really say much about DRC, and before knowing that was the problem I wouldn't even have known what to look for anyway. It seems though that the help is somewhat more extensive than it seemed at first sight. The help reader confused me first so I missed large parts of the manual.

Kicad has a serious learning curve, maybe a steep one for many folks. I found most other pcb creation software also has a learning curve and few are intuitive. At least IMHO.

Yes, I agree that most programs seem awkward and illogical. I have tried Eagle and a few others, but gave up rather quickly, since it seemed like programs I thought I could never stand anyway, and I hate to waste a lot of time to learn a program just to find out that I don't want to use it. Also, for the commercial programs, there are the various limitations for the free version, making it even less interesting to put too much effort into learning a program that may anyway not be sufficient in some cases.

It seems one has to learn to think in a certain way to get used to most commercial and similar programs (including some free ones like Kicad). Maybe there is a reason for some of the awkwardness or maybe it is just a consequence of various historical reasons.

Anyway, having grasped the basics of board layout with Kicad, I think this might be a program I can learn to live with and find more useful than painful. Not the least since it is quite possible to just layout a board without having a netlist or anything, and since there is no limitation on board size etc. It will take some work to fix the worst omissions in the module library, though (or just forget about that too and layout some components as a bunch of single pads).

So thanks for the recommendation. I think Kicad is the first board layout program that is on my computer to stay (apart from MS Paint, that is ).

[pinkmouse]

DRC, or design rule checking, is a very useful tool for catching errors in layouts. It's well worth taking time at some point to learn how it works. Unfortunately I can't help with Kicad as I gave up on it as being way too strange!

[acenovelty]

Howdy Christer,

Hope you are able to make Kicad work for your projects.

One quirk that I've not been able to resolve is updating the software when a new release is published. Seems that "my" library and the master one gets overwritten with the newer version. Does not make for a happy camper when many hours have been spent creating some special versions of a common part for a specific project.

Fortunately, the programs run from the .exe files as stand alone units if desired. You can easily burn the entire program to a CD and take it anywhere.

Regards

[stottie]

Hi

I think i will be sticking to kicad bt since downoading have been busy with family stuff it been xmas and all that!

Anyway im stuck at placing a PAD for examle! Guess its good and free so must need at least need some learning curve.

John

[Christer]

Originally posted by acenovelty

One quirk that I've not been able to resolve is updating the software when a new release is published. Seems that "my" library and the master one gets overwritten with the newer version. Does not make for a happy camper when many hours have been spent creating some special versions of a common part for a specific project.

Since I have just installed it, I haven't run into any update problems yet. However, that is hardly a surprising problem, and a problem one encounters frequently with many programs of different kinds.

I would think the best solution is not to modify the existing libraries, but to put all new modules in one or several new libraries. Unless the distribution suddenly starts using new libraries with the same names as you have choosen, they should presumable be safe from being overwritten when updating. However, one should always make sure to have at least one backup copy. Apart from general backups, I think it may be a good practice to either install the new distribution in a new directory (and then copy your own libraries etc.) or, perhaps simpler, make a copy of the whole Kicad installation just before updating it.

Originally posted by stottie

Anyway im stuck at placing a PAD for examle! Guess its good and free so must need at least need some learning curve.

You mean you want a single pad without placing any particular component? There is the 1PIN module, but that places a pad with a very big hole. For an ordinary sized pad, you can place a PINTST (presumable intended for a test pin).

If you want you could create a new module, called PAD or whatever, by copying the PINTST and change the relevant text field and save it as a new module.

[acenovelty]

"copy of the whole Kicad installation just before updating it",
Done that. Now when copying the old library into the new upgrade, the modded parts must be placed in a bogus project before they will appear in the old project. Kinda like you have to use them first and then it works OK. Bummer.

Since my current version works just fine, I see no reason to upgrade for some minor change that provides a function that I won't use.

[Christer]

Originally posted by acenovelty
"copy of the whole Kicad installation just before updating it",
Done that. Now when copying the old library into the new upgrade, the modded parts must be placed in a bogus project before they will appear in the old project. Kinda like you have to use them first and then it works OK. Bummer.

Well, as I said I haven't tried any upgrading yet, but there seems to be some quirks with defining new modules. I still haven't quite understood when it works and when it doesn't. The various text fields and the names used when saving modules etc. still seems like a mess to me. Maybe there is some clear definition of them in the help files, but I don't think so. Also, if you define a new module and save it into a library while working on a board, you must temporarily delete the library from list of preferences and then add it again. Otherwise it won't show up. However, that is not very surprising and similar things exists in a lot of software. It could be solved if the y wanted to though, and it would make it easier to define new modules.

Since my current version works just fine, I see no reason to upgrade for some minor change that provides a function that I won't use.

The lastes version that seemed to be a stable version that I found was from August this year. There was a December version too, but that was labelled RC1 and is thus probably not considered a stable version.

[acenovelty]

"some clear definition of them in the help files"
If so, I haven't found it yet. Just now starting a new project with some of the same parts, so I'll try a few ways for a work around. If something works more logical, I post you here.