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Old 19th September 2012, 04:38 AM   #11
AJT is offline AJT  Philippines
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry Given View Post
Indianajo,

indeed. the temperature rating alone isnt enough to base a purchasing decision upon. And although it too is necessary, I maintain that high rated lifetime isnt enough either.

there are a lot of really crappy cap manufacturers. there are very few that make excellent quality caps. I've been designing industrial SMPS and motor controllers for 20 years, and will only use the following manufacturers:

Nippon Chemicon, Nichicon, Rubycon, Panasonic

there are some other high quality manufacturers as well (eg Sanyo) but the above four have the best parts - longest rated lifetime, highest ripple current, lowest ESR

In particular I would NEVER buy caps from a chinese manufacturer - and I have made plenty of money by solving problems caused by doing this. Samxon for example make lousy caps, and I dont believe anything their datasheets say wrt lifetime - I have personally disassembled some Samxon caps, and found the internal element OD to be 3mm smaller than the enclosure ID - on some caps but not others - a neat trick for identical components. this gives dreadful thermal performance hence much higher core temperature and significantly lower operating life.

something to be aware of also is specmanship - crappy caps often spec end-of-life at 300% leakage current, 30% capacitance drop. the good ones use 200% & 20%. the difference can be huge - the 300/30 points are a lot further along the time axis, making the spec'd lifetime appear larger.

I have yet to find a better cap than a Rubycon ZLH. any datasheet that purports to do better is probably lying.

but, but, but everything is made in China these days....how about screening for ESR?
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Old 19th September 2012, 04:51 AM   #12
kevinkr is offline kevinkr  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony View Post
but, but, but everything is made in China these days....how about screening for ESR?
It depends quite a lot on whose name is on the entrance to the factory as to what is going out the door.

I use Nichicon, Panasonic, Rubycon, and Nippon Chemicon for most high voltage power supply electrolytics. I know these will generally be reliable.
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Old 19th September 2012, 04:53 AM   #13
AJT is offline AJT  Philippines
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinkr View Post
It depends quite a lot on whose name is on the entrance to the factory as to what is going out the door.

I use Nichicon, Panasonic, Rubycon, and Nippon Chemicon for most high voltage power supply electrolytics. I know these will generally be reliable.
thanks Kevin, i use the same brands myself....
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Old 19th September 2012, 08:47 AM   #14
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I was checking around DigiKey and found the Panasonic FR series caps. Same ESR as the FM series but 5000 vs 2000 hours at 105 C. Only slightly more expensive than FM. 100 uF 25V $13.92 vs $13.44 per hundred.

G
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Old 19th September 2012, 08:54 AM   #15
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Yep, Kevin, Tony et al have the right idea. stick to trusted brands. also only purchase from vendors with a trustworthy supply chain - Digikey for example.

here in NZ the only electronics hobbyist store is Jaycar. And they source the cheapest nastiest crap from china - it is often impossible to determine who even makes the parts. On the bright side, if I ever need a lousy cap for comparison purposes, they are on the shelf.

I've spent a bit of time in various factories in China (wode zhongwen shuode mamahuhu danshi wo man man xue), and I can tell you this - the quality products (eg japanese brands) are made in factories where the brand owners have a strong presence - like an entire floor filled with their engineers. this ensures quality control.

the other approach is to cross ones fingers and hope quality occurs as a result. it doesnt.
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Old 19th September 2012, 09:51 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by RNMarsh View Post
T The 105C are the only ones to use IMO. -Richard Marsh
You reckon i should throw away my 125C M-lytic stash
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Old 19th September 2012, 09:53 AM   #17
Johno is offline Johno  Australia
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Some folks are making unwise generalisations. The Chinese are very good at manufacturing and even better at manufacturing to a price point and do supply exactly what you pay for (irrespective of what you specify).

There is a grey market in Asia and Europe however, muddying the water with counterfeit, re-labelled product. Makes it a challenge to find the right supplier.

That said, I am much more satisfied with my Chinese eBay supplier friends than I am with local Jaycar, RS et al. I spend the time and effort to build a relationship and let them know what it is I want, offer a premium if there is running around to do etc. And this is for DIY quantities. Jaycar refuse, but in fairness RS and Element14 probably would do the same for a larger minimum order size.

Sorry for preaching, but my point is China is a very good source for high quality components in small quantities. Price is reasonable, effort is high.
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Old 19th September 2012, 10:41 AM   #18
fas42 is offline fas42  Australia
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Terry, Jamicon brand, are they tolerable as an alternative at all?

Frank
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Old 19th September 2012, 10:46 AM   #19
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Thanks Terry,
I will have a look at Rubycon ZLH series caps as you recommended.
Coming back to Elna Caps, my original is 470 capacitance (μF) and the one which is closely suitable are:
capacitance (μF) / voltage (Vdc) / body dimension D * L (mm) / Price exc. Vat
ELNAS-160
470
63
18 * 35
4.79
ELNAS-145
330
50
16 * 31
3.25

Should I be concerned about (μF) difference as my original is 470 by swopping it to 330? Also if I would go for 470 I would have 63 voltage (Vdc) where mine is 40 V.
As mine is 8mm Width, by banding the capacitors pins in order to fit to the circuit board, will it affect the capacitors performance?

Many thanks for your help guys, I just decided to do the maximum upgrade possible to get the pest possible sound performance from these loved player.
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Old 19th September 2012, 11:05 AM   #20
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Terry, I had been recommended this Elna Caps for my project (described above)
2 PCS ELNA Rfs silmic II FOR AUDIO CAPACITOR 470Uf/50V
eBay link: 2 PCS ELNA Rfs silmic II FOR AUDIO CAPACITOR 470Uf/50V | eBayWould you think these are GOOD quality?
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