Film dialectrics have a much lower ESR than electrolytics.
ESR = D.F./(2*PI*f*C)
D.F - Dissapation Factor
f = frequency
C = Capacitance
Some DF samples:
FC (10V): .22
FC (50V): .10
FC (100V): .07
AVX BF Polyester (same at 1kHz and 100kHz): .01
Wima MKP2 Polyprop: 1kHz: .0005, 10kHz: .0008, 100kHz: .003
Time for coffee.
Also, a good read:
http://www.designers-guide.org/Design/bypassing.pdf
We like to use FC or FM(even lower ESR) for decoupling together with a small film (like .22uF) for bypassing.
ESR = D.F./(2*PI*f*C)
D.F - Dissapation Factor
f = frequency
C = Capacitance
Some DF samples:
FC (10V): .22
FC (50V): .10
FC (100V): .07
AVX BF Polyester (same at 1kHz and 100kHz): .01
Wima MKP2 Polyprop: 1kHz: .0005, 10kHz: .0008, 100kHz: .003
Time for coffee.
Also, a good read:
http://www.designers-guide.org/Design/bypassing.pdf
We like to use FC or FM(even lower ESR) for decoupling together with a small film (like .22uF) for bypassing.
lumanauw said:
IMO yes it will. The lower THD+N is well worth it. I have not found much of anything you could not use (audio) the LME49710/LM4562. The only thing I probably would not use it for would be a DC nulling servo (though I suppose it would work fine there too).
I have not used it in a CDP, but I have used to do BAL to SE conversion for my DAC.
BrianDonegan said:
Thanks for the info Brian!
I'm almost embarassed to say I find that maths a bit hard to follow. How would the ESR @ 1khz compare between a 33uF/50v Fc to a 220nF polyester? If the general idea in my mind is correct the electrolytic is far lower impedance, with the film cap only having an impact (or none at all) at very high frequencies (depending on lead length and thickness?).
Interestingly I find the sound of my power amp improved using 100nF in series with 1R across the main smoothing caps.
Simon
The funny part is: i tried a Audyn-cap plus MKP 6.8 uF, swapped it for a standard MKP Audyn-cap. I didn't like the sound of plus above the standard as coupling cap at least.
I swapped a standard Philips lytic for a BG N type: didn't like it either above the standard PS caps.
My theory: both BG N and Audyn-cap plus are made of two caps in series. All extra material for the sound or HF noise barrier to pass through. The Audyn plus has this design to reduce parasitic inductions. The BG N to get it suitable for bipolar using, not sure though.
Have good experience in analoge PS with Panasonics.
seftali said:
Batteries are inferior to a good regulated supply in many specs (impedance & noise versus bandwidth), and if you are using those small 9V batteries (216 size) they will go flat in just a few hours.
I am using LM4562 in the output of a Pioneer DV676AS CD/DVD/SACD player with LM317/337 regulators in the power supply to give +/-16V. It sounds great.
Re: Re: LM4562 distortion performance
National Semi shows a test setup for the LM4562 and Audio Precision on the product sheet. You could probably do it with one of the Boonton 1120's -- it reads distortion to 5 places to the right of the decimal sign but the oscillator in the 1120 will never get you there. The Linear Technologies super oscillator will get down to vanishingly low levels of distortion, so will Cyril Bateman's in his Capacitor series in EW.
You could do it with a spectrum analyzer, or something as easy to acquire as an HP3581, which has a most sensitive scale of 100 nano-Volts, but the oscillator is going to be the limiting factor.
Russ White said:
National Semi shows a test setup for the LM4562 and Audio Precision on the product sheet. You could probably do it with one of the Boonton 1120's -- it reads distortion to 5 places to the right of the decimal sign but the oscillator in the 1120 will never get you there. The Linear Technologies super oscillator will get down to vanishingly low levels of distortion, so will Cyril Bateman's in his Capacitor series in EW.
You could do it with a spectrum analyzer, or something as easy to acquire as an HP3581, which has a most sensitive scale of 100 nano-Volts, but the oscillator is going to be the limiting factor.
Tried LM4562 in my RIAA preamp.
My RIAA preamp has an OPA2134 at the input and followed by an AD826. The equalisation is passive.
Replacing the OPA2134 with the LM4562 softens the sound considerably . Keeping the OPA and replacing the AD826 was more acceptable. They sound very similar but the sound of brass for example seems ( very marginally ) more rounded off ( less bite ) with the LM4562. Bass on the AD826 sounds punchy and on the LM4562 it seems to have a bit more weight though not as punchy.
I tested this over headphones ( Sennheiser HD580). It will have to be done over speakers next time.
Additionally I had an offset problem in my preamp. With the stock chips I got a dc off set less than 1.6mV . With the LM I got around 28mV . I never checked why this was so but the LM will not be used in this circuit. I will now have to try it out as a standard preamp with some gain.
The LM4562 is a good sounding chip .
Cheers.
My RIAA preamp has an OPA2134 at the input and followed by an AD826. The equalisation is passive.
Replacing the OPA2134 with the LM4562 softens the sound considerably . Keeping the OPA and replacing the AD826 was more acceptable. They sound very similar but the sound of brass for example seems ( very marginally ) more rounded off ( less bite ) with the LM4562. Bass on the AD826 sounds punchy and on the LM4562 it seems to have a bit more weight though not as punchy.
I tested this over headphones ( Sennheiser HD580). It will have to be done over speakers next time.
Additionally I had an offset problem in my preamp. With the stock chips I got a dc off set less than 1.6mV . With the LM I got around 28mV . I never checked why this was so but the LM will not be used in this circuit. I will now have to try it out as a standard preamp with some gain.
The LM4562 is a good sounding chip .
Cheers.
CD/DVD/SACD output using LM4562
A small 20VA toroid, 15V+15V 0.666A. See http://www.jaycar.com.au/productVie...&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=539
seftali said:
A small 20VA toroid, 15V+15V 0.666A. See http://www.jaycar.com.au/productVie...&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax=&SUBCATID=539
Just me then...
I used an Audio Precision System One whereof the THD floor is 0.0005% 10 Hz - 2 kHz, rising to 0.0014% at 20 kHz.
I measured the 4562 in series and shunt feedback modes with gains up to 3.2x, and you can't see any difference from the analyser floor. But that also applies with the 5532.
In series mode with significant source resistance then there is distortion (everyone knows about this effect, I assume?) but the plots for LM4562 and 5532 are almost identical.
I'll put the plots on my website when I get a moment.
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/
I used an Audio Precision System One whereof the THD floor is 0.0005% 10 Hz - 2 kHz, rising to 0.0014% at 20 kHz.
I measured the 4562 in series and shunt feedback modes with gains up to 3.2x, and you can't see any difference from the analyser floor. But that also applies with the 5532.
In series mode with significant source resistance then there is distortion (everyone knows about this effect, I assume?) but the plots for LM4562 and 5532 are almost identical.
I'll put the plots on my website when I get a moment.
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/
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