In my newfound quest to perfect home PCB manufacturing, I have become interested in using a heated rolling laminator in place of an iron when using the toner transfer PCB method since getting even transfers seems to be the weak link in my process (though I have been getting better!! 
). Looking into it, there seem to be a multitude of laminators on the market, and I was wondering if people who had used them would care to comment on which one they own and how well it works.
Staples has a cheap one here that seems to take a variety of thicknesses of material, which would seem to be a pre-requisite for any laminator one would wish to use to do thermal transfers. If anyone has used this particular model or one similar, I would especially be interested to hear how it worked.
Thanks!!
). Looking into it, there seem to be a multitude of laminators on the market, and I was wondering if people who had used them would care to comment on which one they own and how well it works. Staples has a cheap one here that seems to take a variety of thicknesses of material, which would seem to be a pre-requisite for any laminator one would wish to use to do thermal transfers. If anyone has used this particular model or one similar, I would especially be interested to hear how it worked.
Thanks!!
We have one of the huge 60" wide ones, but it's a pain to load and unolad. Thus the quest for a smaller desktop one. I don't really want to commit $75 just to try one out (since I won't really have a use for it since I don't need a laminator), but I think I might just bite the bullet for the greater good if nobody knows if it is any good or not.pinkmouse said:
David
Considering the time it takes to drill a complex board, a "bare bones" PCB from Advanced Circuits makes sense if you are using a CAD program to design your board.
For something like $45 plus a per square inch charge you can get a two sided board in 1 oz. copper with plated through holes. It works out to 10 boards 80mm x 100 mm for ~$100 plus shipping. The turnaround is one day. The boards are every bit as good as their regular production boards, minus the silkscreen and soldermask. I don't think I'll be making my own boards anytime soon.
For something like $45 plus a per square inch charge you can get a two sided board in 1 oz. copper with plated through holes. It works out to 10 boards 80mm x 100 mm for ~$100 plus shipping. The turnaround is one day. The boards are every bit as good as their regular production boards, minus the silkscreen and soldermask. I don't think I'll be making my own boards anytime soon.
Slacker!
Seriously though, there are some boards I want just one of, and spending $3 vs $50 is a pretty substantial difference in my book. It is all relative, though, I suppose. If your time is worth more than mine)) then it definitely makes more sense to have somebody else make boards for you.
Also, I have used Olimex to get cheap boards with solder mask and silkscreen for cheap, but the shipping time is a killer.
Seriously though, there are some boards I want just one of, and spending $3 vs $50 is a pretty substantial difference in my book. It is all relative, though, I suppose. If your time is worth more than mine
)) then it definitely makes more sense to have somebody else make boards for you. Also, I have used Olimex to get cheap boards with solder mask and silkscreen for cheap, but the shipping time is a killer.
Whilst Advanced do provide a good service, there are times when you just want one board just to test out a concept, or prototype a circuit. For instance, when I did the Krell GB, I made 3 iterations of the board before I was happy to release it even to the beta tester, that adds up very quickly...
Well, Bob, you certainly have made that "10 to 100" limit on your past couple of projects with the xovers and PSU's!!!BobEllis said:
As for the point to point, I must sadly admit how badly I have failed at that each time I have had to connect more than a couple of IC's and resistors! I never can seem to get it right! So indeed, to each his own.
PS Have you tried the $33 specials at Advanced? That looks to be a pretty good deal as well.
Laminators require some modification for toner transfer.
Firstly, they run too fast. So you will need to change to motor for a slower one (about 1/5 the speed).
Secondly, you will need to change the temperature to suit your toner.
A double roller laminator(by this I mean a laminator with two pairs of rollers - in and out), with a central heater is better than the single roller types.
I gave up on my laminator and built a vacuum hotplate instead.
Of course, you could just buy one readymade for the job!
Firstly, they run too fast. So you will need to change to motor for a slower one (about 1/5 the speed).
Secondly, you will need to change the temperature to suit your toner.
A double roller laminator(by this I mean a laminator with two pairs of rollers - in and out), with a central heater is better than the single roller types.
I gave up on my laminator and built a vacuum hotplate instead.
Of course, you could just buy one readymade for the job!
I took some equipment with nice voltmeters to use in a project of mine, stripped the components off and put them on some perfboard with plated vias... I point-to-point wired all the components, maybe 5 ICs and a few handfuls of resistors, caps etc...
Took FOREVER and was a serious pain in the rear. Next time I make a circuit that's moderately complex it will be with a PCB, even if it's just with dremel'd traces on a solid-copper board. For small stuff that doesn't have complicated failure modes, point-to-point is cool.
Drilling a PCB is no sweat with a press...well almost, but for a big PCB at that price/inch the cost adds up higher than the time is worth (to me at least)
Took FOREVER and was a serious pain in the rear. Next time I make a circuit that's moderately complex it will be with a PCB, even if it's just with dremel'd traces on a solid-copper board. For small stuff that doesn't have complicated failure modes, point-to-point is cool.
Drilling a PCB is no sweat with a press...well almost, but for a big PCB at that price/inch the cost adds up higher than the time is worth (to me at least)
BobEllis said:
I have "kind of" stopped making PCB's -- I plan my projects and research such that I can send out for a couple of prototypes while cooking up something else. I use ExpressPCB and PCBExpress (both) -- turnaround is just a few days if you have a FedEx account. It's the drilling which is annoying, even though I have a Grizzly mini-mill --
The thing I am worried about is "Variable board thickness: Insert any board thickness from .032” thickness down to super-flexible .003” flex."TwoSpoons said:
The boards I typically use are 0.064"
Plus, their 0.003" boards use 1/2oz copper coating, and I am calibrated to 1oz traces. I have even lamented not usign 2oz copper at times, so anything under 1oz is out in my book.Otherwise, it looks like a good deal.
All I have is a normal 14" drill press, but it seems to do the job just fine. I have thought about building one of the dremel presses everyone suggests, but I haven't found the need too yet. I probably should invest in some finer bits, but so far so good using what I have. I guess it is a matter of opinion, but drilling has never really bothered me. Go figure.jackinnj said:
David
my son sent me this link to modifying an HP laser printer engine as a fuser - laminator:
http://www.storm.ca/~rheslip/pcbfuser.htm
http://www.storm.ca/~rheslip/pcbfuser.htm
and while I am at it -- i found that the Dremel was not acurate enough for carbide bits -- but with the Grizzly very few break. I use the hss bits (Injectoral) from Digikey -- when they wear out throw-away. You can also get great deals on PCB drills on EBay -- but it is time consuming.
At least with the mill if you are cutting rows of holes for DIP's or Molex sockets you just crank thewheel to move horizontally or vertically for a specified number of mills or millimeters.
At least with the mill if you are cutting rows of holes for DIP's or Molex sockets you just crank thewheel to move horizontally or vertically for a specified number of mills or millimeters.
Thanks for the link. I love the idea, but I am a little concerned by these comments:jackinnj said:
I know I can get an inexpensive "refuser for" 0.032" PCB's but I am still a little concerned about using anything less than 1oz. copper. I haven't seen 0.32" with more than 1/2oz.
Still, I'm not ready to give up quite yet!!!
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.