Equiv. Parts: 2SD669, 2SB649 - Page 2 - diyAudio
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Old 20th September 2002, 08:24 AM   #11
Rarkov is offline Rarkov  England
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Hi,
Randy didn't say which of the MJE series his friends crossed to, but since ON Semi said that the MJE350 and 344 are compatible (or will even just do) then that's fine by me...They are sending out 20 of each on a sample order!!!

That just makes it even better! 40 free...I don't build amps often so that'll last me a long time!

Thanks,
Gaz
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Old 20th September 2002, 10:26 AM   #12
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Rarkov,

I have checked a number of different manufacturers compatibility
recommendations, and they were all questionable.
The problem is that SB649/SD669 are rather
special devices and not many manufacturers have something
similar. It seems that they basically try to find a device that
is "safe" to use, ie. greater or equal VCE, IC and power rating,
and do not care much about other properties. Obviously, ON
does not even make sure that the IC rating is sufficient.

It will most likely work to use the suggested ON devices in
any of Sloanes amplifiers, but be prepared that tech. specs.
and sound quality may be inferior. To what extent is probably
hard to predict though.

Anyway, go ahead and use the ON devices if you want to
give them a try. If it sounds good, be happy, otherwise, try
to get hold of better devices. Just make sure that you don't
need the higher IC rating in the particular design your building.
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Old 20th September 2002, 10:37 AM   #13
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I remember quite a while ago i emailed Randy Slone with the same problem, ie. I couldn't source the Hitachi 2sd669/2sb649 bjt's and his reply was...

"There isn't anything "super special" about the 2SD669/2SB649 devices. You should be able to obtain equal results from several devices in the "MJE" line - just try to match the Hfe, Ft, and Pd parameters fairly close, and the performance should be equal. "

(hope Randy doesn't mind me quoting him, hehe)
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Old 20th September 2002, 11:09 AM   #14
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I agree there is nothing "super special" about SB649/SD669
except the particular combination of essential parameters.
The problem is to find a close match for all of these. I just
tried the parametric search at ON semi again, to see if I had
missed some possible replacement in my earlier searches, but
it seems I hadn't. Assuming we want a min VCE >= 150V and
IC >= 500mA, there is only MJE 344 and some similar devices
for even higher voltages (I only bothered checking for NPNs).

The most problematic parameter is fT, which is about 10% of
the value for SD669. I don't know how much difference this
will make in practice, but it is one of the parameters Sloane
list as crucial ones for a driver. Also, looking at similar japanese
devices designed for driver stages, they typically have a high
fT. I guess this all boils down to the old discussion of how much
bandwidth is needed in an amplifier. Most certainly there is
quite a lot of expensive and good-sounding amplifiers on the
market using drivers similar to MJE344/350.

Actually, when rechecking my local supplier, I just realized that
MJE340 seems more similar to MJE350, than MJE344 does. This
also made me recheck the datasheets and there is no spec. for
the fT value at all for MJE340/350. That is why I had dismissed
these devices and forgotten about them.
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Old 4th May 2003, 04:24 PM   #15
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Default SPice models

Does anyone know where I could get SPICE models for these? I'm simulating Sloane's amp in bSPICER, well I'm attempting too

David
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Old 4th May 2003, 06:04 PM   #16
sam9 is offline sam9  United States
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Default 2sd669/2sb649 source

A: MCM carries these. Or at least it did once. It now appears to be part of Newark -- so who knows?


B: I built a rather low powered version of one of Slone's amps to squeeze into a small box under my PC monitor to drive a set of small speakers. If you discount my fumblings and goofs, it was quite straight forward. I had access to an older distortion analyzer (measures down to .003%) and was unable to even get a reading in the audible spectrum until 20kHz, --which has been inauible to me for the last couple of decades! I'm working on higher powered version presently.
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Old 5th May 2003, 04:57 PM   #17
sam9 is offline sam9  United States
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Default Alternative ? Maybe?

I just happened to notice the Zetex "Super E-line" page in the Digikey catalog. Going strictly by the basic numbers, some of these could sub for 2sb649/2sd669. However, they are a modified to-92 package which leads me to wonder if there is more at issue than just the basic specs.

if you need to heatsink them you would need to be a little creative since the package isn't even stanadrd TO-92 - kind of squished flat. Also a little pricey.
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Old 7th May 2003, 01:27 AM   #18
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Default I think I found good replacements, what sayest thou?

I agree with other on the board about the MJE series from On- Semi. Looks to be a far stretch.

How about these replacements from Zetex? They have equivalent SPICE models.

Hitachi NPN 2SD669 replacements :
Zetex ZTX1055A or ZTX1056A

Hitachi PNP 2SB649 replacements :
FZT955

What do you think? All the parameters seem pretty close

Eternalightwithin

P.S. For those who don't know that data for these, www.Zetex.com for the Zetex BJTs and Hitachis stuff can be found in the diyaudio archives.
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Old 11th May 2003, 05:05 PM   #19
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Default another possible substitute?

The data specs on (Ic) and (Ft) seem close with the NTE 373 and NTE 374. this may provide a better match than the MJE series.....
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Old 15th May 2003, 05:04 PM   #20
sam9 is offline sam9  United States
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I spent several hours on an extensive web search. I've concluded there are not any official models. Some Spice software (but not the free ones) have modules that will try to build a model from datasheet info. If someone on the forum has that capability maybe they would be kind enough to plug in the data sheet info andshare the result.
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