Ok so I am beging to aquire the parts I need to built a BOSOZ, and Im trying to keep the price down, without a major compromise in quality. First question is, what is a good switch to use for a stepped attentuator. I have seen lots of them, seems like as soon as you get enough switch positions, the price jumps drasticly. Only ones I have looked at are the Elma Rotary, which seem to be the standard, and the cost is ok, but I wouldnt mind a better value if possible. Any cheaper ones, or is 40-50 bucks gonna be the cost.
Next is the RCA jacks, whats a good RCA value. I was looking at Vampire, Cardas, and various others. Seems like for 4-5 bucks, Cardas has a nice one, as does Vampire. Any non-name brand ones that are a good value for even less. Getting enough RCA's for a whole preamp adds up.
Next is the RCA jacks, whats a good RCA value. I was looking at Vampire, Cardas, and various others. Seems like for 4-5 bucks, Cardas has a nice one, as does Vampire. Any non-name brand ones that are a good value for even less. Getting enough RCA's for a whole preamp adds up.
It's a bit of an impossible site to link to, but www.dalbani.com has some RCA's that are pretty decent, and are $0.95 each.. (but shhh it's my secret supply.)
Hi,
well, if I can explain the sonic improvement. Isn't that obvious? Just kidding
It is of the ladder type so there are only two resistors in the signal path at each volume setting. One is in series with the signal and the other is connected to ground. Thus, there are 96 resistors in total.
Yes, both are 10k. The ALPS black is log, and the stpped attenuator is LIN.
Maybe it is the material in the ALPS that is not as good as the DALE resistors?
Or is it that the ALPS is 3 dB between channels while a stepped attenuator with 0.1 and 0.5% resistors and that gives much better channel tracking? My guess is that the better sound stage is mostly due to this fact.
The better details and clearer sound and better treble is due to fact that there is less noise and less distortion and better high freq response of the stepped attenuator.
Borbely's Superbuffer1 really gives me the possibility to hear every detail. This buffer has extreme resolution!
Actually, the reason to why it sounds better is not the most important thing. That it does sound much better is the most important thing to me.
Sigurd
well, if I can explain the sonic improvement. Isn't that obvious? Just kidding
It is of the ladder type so there are only two resistors in the signal path at each volume setting. One is in series with the signal and the other is connected to ground. Thus, there are 96 resistors in total.
Yes, both are 10k. The ALPS black is log, and the stpped attenuator is LIN.
Maybe it is the material in the ALPS that is not as good as the DALE resistors?
Or is it that the ALPS is 3 dB between channels while a stepped attenuator with 0.1 and 0.5% resistors and that gives much better channel tracking? My guess is that the better sound stage is mostly due to this fact.
The better details and clearer sound and better treble is due to fact that there is less noise and less distortion and better high freq response of the stepped attenuator.
Borbely's Superbuffer1 really gives me the possibility to hear every detail. This buffer has extreme resolution!
Actually, the reason to why it sounds better is not the most important thing. That it does sound much better is the most important thing to me.
Sigurd
How much in american dollars does that cost, I think its probably still more than I want.
As for the RCA's, those are cheap, but I have to say, they look it too. They look better than I normlaly see for 95 cents, but they sorta look like the steel ones I see on so many peices of gear, look nice, perform so so. I may go with a better one. It also probably has a Delring Dialectric, might be ok, I always melt that unless I plug into it to protect it.
Anyone else no of any others that are more like say 2-4 dollars a piece, in that range, or even maybe 5-6 a piece but better than the name brand ones for that. thanks.
As for the RCA's, those are cheap, but I have to say, they look it too. They look better than I normlaly see for 95 cents, but they sorta look like the steel ones I see on so many peices of gear, look nice, perform so so. I may go with a better one. It also probably has a Delring Dialectric, might be ok, I always melt that unless I plug into it to protect it.
Anyone else no of any others that are more like say 2-4 dollars a piece, in that range, or even maybe 5-6 a piece but better than the name brand ones for that. thanks.
Actually they are nice thick machined brass, then gold plated.. Yes they don't have a really nice smooth finish on them and the plastic has some seam marks but at least they come with insulators. (also the picture is pretty crappy)
They are very comparable to these http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=091-1120
And of course the dayton parts are an option too.
They are very comparable to these http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=091-1120
And of course the dayton parts are an option too.
officeboy said:
Yeah they look identical, other than the different coloured plastic insulators..
Dont think just because its 95 cents it means its crap. The cost of production is tiny, if you put a brand or reputation on it you can pump up the price 2-10 times.
Local RP electronics sells the same for about 2$ cdn:
http://www.rpelectronics.com/English/Content/Items/351-707-10.asp
Upupa Epops - if that is the case, then it surely is the stepped attenuator that does it all. I am really glad I bought it. Was a bit difficult to assemble, but after 3h work, it was ready to be installed in my preamp.
My next idea is to exchange some of the resistors (the ones that are most frequently used) with either Vishay Bulk Metal Foil resistors or Caddock MK132s. The Caddocks are rectangular and will be hard to fit into the small space availble in the ELMA rotary switch. Same with the Vishay S102s and also the naked ones made by Texas Components, the TX2352s.
The price is 119 Euro for ELMA rotary switch and the resistor. That is including the German VAT which is 16%. A bargain for the sound improvement it gives - IMHO.
Sigurd
My next idea is to exchange some of the resistors (the ones that are most frequently used) with either Vishay Bulk Metal Foil resistors or Caddock MK132s. The Caddocks are rectangular and will be hard to fit into the small space availble in the ELMA rotary switch. Same with the Vishay S102s and also the naked ones made by Texas Components, the TX2352s.
The price is 119 Euro for ELMA rotary switch and the resistor. That is including the German VAT which is 16%. A bargain for the sound improvement it gives - IMHO.
Sigurd
Ok well I ordered a small sample of them, 4, see how I like em. They do look a bit rough and they look like the supposedly steel oens that are used on products like my Acurus amplifier. They are so cheap that I can gonna try experimenting with them in a manner similar to Eichmen maybe. Try cutting the metal outer band so that the contact is smaller, creating a supposed greater concentration of electrons. If it doesnt work, oh well, no harm no foul.
I really do prefer and enjoy using the over priced thick teflon dialectric copper or brass base metal connectors from the likes of Cardas and Vampire. I dont agree that what you have shown is the equal of them, but they probably are a good buy. My biggest complaint about the plastic dialectrics is that its melts when soldering them, sometimes seeping around the center conduter if its not a ring, which is probably better than a ring for conductivity, but less than ideal for reliability. But placing an unused plug into the jack usually works well enough as a heat sink, so I will just try that. Thanks again.
As for the stepped attentuator, again, I am gonna start with trying to make one myself. I have Holco resistors galore, and at 8-12 cents a piece, are pretty cheap for a good sounding resistor. I just wondered if any other option, other than the Elma rotary switches, existed. They are, Im sure, very good, but pricey too.
I really do prefer and enjoy using the over priced thick teflon dialectric copper or brass base metal connectors from the likes of Cardas and Vampire. I dont agree that what you have shown is the equal of them, but they probably are a good buy. My biggest complaint about the plastic dialectrics is that its melts when soldering them, sometimes seeping around the center conduter if its not a ring, which is probably better than a ring for conductivity, but less than ideal for reliability. But placing an unused plug into the jack usually works well enough as a heat sink, so I will just try that. Thanks again.
As for the stepped attentuator, again, I am gonna start with trying to make one myself. I have Holco resistors galore, and at 8-12 cents a piece, are pretty cheap for a good sounding resistor. I just wondered if any other option, other than the Elma rotary switches, existed. They are, Im sure, very good, but pricey too.
Allied has gold plated rca's for a bit more ($2.34 each). I haven't tried them yet, but I probably will for my next project. I like their catalog since they sell pretty much everything...
Here's the link:
http://www.alliedelec.com/cart/ProductDetail.asp?SKU=283-2750&SEARCH=rca+jack&ID=&DESC=ZC%2D2750GR
Anyone use these before? They are manufactured by Alectron
Here's the link:
http://www.alliedelec.com/cart/ProductDetail.asp?SKU=283-2750&SEARCH=rca+jack&ID=&DESC=ZC%2D2750GR
Anyone use these before? They are manufactured by Alectron
Have you seen this alps switch? http://store.yahoo.com/triodeel/4pol24posals.html
Price is right, I haven't tried one myself but have heard good things about it.
Mark
Price is right, I haven't tried one myself but have heard good things about it.
Mark
For $2.10 each shipped I don't think you can beat these RCA jacks in terms of value and quality
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=32838&item=5750514640&rd=1
I bought some a few months ago from the same place on Ebay and they are great. Very heavy and solid. When I run out I will buy them again.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=32838&item=5750514640&rd=1
I bought some a few months ago from the same place on Ebay and they are great. Very heavy and solid. When I run out I will buy them again.
I bought some of these and there not bad for 1.50 each.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3284&item=5757983031&rd=1
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3284&item=5757983031&rd=1
Incremental upgrades
Yes I too have the bug to continuously improve my system. The person who introduced me to the high end advised strongly not to go the incremental upgrade route.
His advice was as follows: "You'll just spend way more money in the long run improving each piece in gradual steps than you will getting the very best you can possibly afford for each piece as you go" Of course I ignored his advice and have since replaced every piece more than once, guess what? he was right.
I built a passive pre using a solid silver switch (Schallco) and Vishay foil resistors, pure silver wire and excellent Cardas RCA jacks. I am delighted with the result and am pretty sure this piece will never need upgrading. The parts cost me $350 not counting a chassis. I bought a n inexpesive passive on the used market, gutted it and used the box, knobs, front panel etc. So I don't have a homemade look and sound close to as good as it gets.
I know you could shop arround and get all the same functionality for probably less than half, but I've never heard any volume POT that matches a stepped resistor ladder. And next year or the year after that, you'll once again wonder if your pre-amp might be the limitation in your system.
Yes I too have the bug to continuously improve my system. The person who introduced me to the high end advised strongly not to go the incremental upgrade route.
His advice was as follows: "You'll just spend way more money in the long run improving each piece in gradual steps than you will getting the very best you can possibly afford for each piece as you go" Of course I ignored his advice and have since replaced every piece more than once, guess what? he was right.
I built a passive pre using a solid silver switch (Schallco) and Vishay foil resistors, pure silver wire and excellent Cardas RCA jacks. I am delighted with the result and am pretty sure this piece will never need upgrading. The parts cost me $350 not counting a chassis. I bought a n inexpesive passive on the used market, gutted it and used the box, knobs, front panel etc. So I don't have a homemade look and sound close to as good as it gets.
I know you could shop arround and get all the same functionality for probably less than half, but I've never heard any volume POT that matches a stepped resistor ladder. And next year or the year after that, you'll once again wonder if your pre-amp might be the limitation in your system.
actually those heavy duty ones look nice, I may try those out and see. Maybe use some better ones from Cardas on the amp output jacks and Vinyl unput jacks. I have a few sources I dont care as much about, but those two are important to me, dont want to compromise. Another person showed some that, though they are better priced, look identical to Radioshacks, and if they are, are complete junk. I had a set litterally fall apart just form use in a very short period of time.
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