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Old 26th October 2017, 10:14 AM   #11
DF96 is offline DF96  England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DualTriode
Why was silver plated teflon insulated wire specified for aerospace?
I would need to Google to find out, but my guess is that teflon is fire-resistant - useful in areospace; possibly PVC can creep if put under pressure. Silver plating good for VHF and above. Certainly nothing to do with audio quality!
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Old 26th October 2017, 04:57 PM   #12
DualTriode is offline DualTriode  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DF96 View Post
I would need to Google to find out, but my guess is that teflon is fire-resistant - useful in areospace; possibly PVC can creep if put under pressure. Silver plating good for VHF and above. Certainly nothing to do with audio quality!
I took you suggestion and went to Google.

PTFE vs. PVC has greater resistance to heat or melting, is less flammable and generates less smoke.

Silver vs. copper has ~ 6% greater conductivity or conversely copper has ~ 6% greater resistance than silver.

Proponents of PTFE insulated silver plated wire claim sonic improvements over copper wire due to skin effect.

For a discussion of skin effect at audio frequencies see this Belden link. Understanding Skin Effect and Frequency

Skin effect does not come into play at audio frequencies.

DT
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Old 26th October 2017, 06:21 PM   #13
rayma is online now rayma  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DualTriode View Post
silver plated teflon insulated wire does not benifit audio but has application for UF.
When Teflon insulation is used, silver plating on the copper is necessary to prevent oxidation.
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Old 26th October 2017, 06:47 PM   #14
DualTriode is offline DualTriode  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rayma View Post
When Teflon insulation is used, silver plating on the copper is necessary to prevent oxidation.
Is that because of the potential reaction between copper and PTFE. Or that both PTFE and silver are both better suited to harsh environments than PVC insulated bare copper.

In air plenums where fire and smoke are the primary issue PTFE insulated copper cables are not uncommon.

DT
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Old 26th October 2017, 08:57 PM   #15
rayma is online now rayma  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DualTriode View Post
Is that because of the potential reaction between copper and PTFE. Or that both PTFE
and silver are both better suited to harsh environments than PVC insulated bare copper.
It's because of the high temperatures involved in the mfg process.
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Old 26th October 2017, 10:14 PM   #16
DualTriode is offline DualTriode  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rayma View Post
It's because of the high temperatures involved in the mfg process.
Thanks for that information.
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Old 27th October 2017, 11:36 AM   #17
DF96 is offline DF96  England
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So the only reason to use teflon coated silver plated wiring in audio is to get less smoke under serious fault conditions. Even aerospace doesn't use silver plating for electrical reasons. As SY used to point out (he is an expert on these things), teflon on silver is a bad combination for triboelectricity so such cables might be microphonic or suffer from handling noise - so a poor choice for audio, especially low level signals.
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Old 29th October 2017, 11:30 PM   #18
DualTriode is offline DualTriode  United States
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Default Has anyone tested silver plated Teflon insulated hookup wire?

Hello,

I am not ready to trash my newly found stash of silver plated copper Teflon insulated hookup wire.

Has anyone tested the claimed possible negative effects of silver vs Teflon or on the other side the claimed brighter effect of silver plated copper vs copper alone?

DT

Last edited by DualTriode; 29th October 2017 at 11:46 PM.
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Old 30th October 2017, 07:07 AM   #19
50AE is offline 50AE  Bulgaria
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Chassis wire
I've noticed that under higher than room temperature, copper wire near well biased tubes within a PVC insulation tends to develop a greenish, copper chloride patina. The resulting copper wire appears to be more mechanically fragile.

A possible explanation is that PVC tends to break down at higher temperatures, releasing chlorine and the later reacts with the copper metal. It's used as a chlorine donor in colored pyrotechnic mixtures after all.

Teflon on the other end, can release fluorine gas which is not a lesser evil, but this happens at higher temperatures than PVC.

As for the silver coated copper wire, lots of us folks subjectively detest it for the known, brightly harsh sound in the midrange domain.
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Old 30th October 2017, 11:35 AM   #20
DF96 is offline DF96  England
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Physics says that silver wiring will sound exactly the same as copper wiring. I am not aware of any tests (electrical measurements or ears-only listening) which show anything else. However, there are lots of anecdotes about silver wiring sounding bright and copper sounding dull; the correlation between these descriptions and the surface appearance of the metal may be pure coincidence.
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