Hi-fi boss slams 'rip-off' industry: Article in Techradar

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Reread your post and my analysis. PEAKS.



No, I didn't. Reread what I wrote.

ironic

I said 'they probably mean PMPO or something' Peak Music Power Output, which is included in the very line the 2 of you seems to quote and disagree with.

it doesnt take a 500W rated amp to put out 500W peaks. maybe i'm oldschool, I rate my amps RMS.

500W peaks needed for normal listening levels? I think its this guy thats uninformed. maybe he means PMPO
 
it doesnt take a 500W rated amp to put out 500W peaks. maybe i'm oldschool, I rate my amps RMS.

You need a 500W amp to put out 500W (average) peaks unless you have something with terrible dynamic regulation and very low idle current. If you want to count only the tips of non-recurring peaks, then 250WRMS will get you there, or you could just add 3dB to my numbers to get back to 500W.

The point remains, the numbers suggested in that article are not at all ridiculous unless you like peak clipping and limiting or only listen to limited dynamic range material.
 
i'll tell you when I finally finish the new amps/speakers =) depends on the final bias (percentage class A) I go for and I wont know that till i'm finished. I use a fully regulated SMPS for the mid-bass and Sub-bass which will put out short term burst/peak power thats ~20-25% higher than constant and i'm running tri amped with digital XO, with Class A on Midbass, Class D on Sub bass and high bias AB or A on highs. i've probably got way more available power than I actually need. but I have the power to choose the gain yet

new system, new speakers, new address

so maybe its me thats not normal =)

Sy, you keep on misquoting me, I said and have kept on saying it was ridiculous to claim that is normal, for normal listening levels, not that 500W is ridiculous
 
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I don't see where SY has misquoted you at all. He just saying that a 500W amp is not outside the realm of normal. I certainly don't need 500W of amp (more like 5W) but folks with large rooms and inefficient speakers might.

If your average power is 3W, then you'd need a 500W amp to stay out of clipping on most dynamic recordings. I don't think most of us run at 3W average power, but it's possible.
 
your example was using unusually dynamic material (not for you I know, but for the unwashed, lets call them normal people), with slightly lower than average efficiency speakers, in larger than average rooms. basically an example framed to make it seem reasonable, every factor slightly (the program material heavily) weighted in one direction
 
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True SY, and that's why the numbers can vary so wildly.

Qusp - I have a lot of rock/pop CDs with an RMS to peak value of 25dB or more. Of course big band and classical recording are normally like that, but they aren't alone. Of course anything in the past few years is squashed, but older releases are not.
 
the vast majority of modern available music is not highly dymanic and that factor was the big swinger in the calculation. normal people do not unfortunately listen to dynamic material, hell most people seem to listen to movies
 
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anyway I think we all understand the details of the arguments, I really dont want to argue with you guys, I actually like you both and ive had enough of argument today.

actually that was much more like discourse, everyone kept their heads (reasonably) cool, but you know what I mean.

re the market, yes Pano at both ends of the scale, like anything the market and society today, wealth is squashed at the extremes, people who want to pay nothing and people that will pay anything for image
 
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normal people do not unfortunately listen to dynamic material
I know I'm not normal, but do you have to rub it in? :D

Carly Simon, Elton John, The Doors. I think these CDs and other like them could be considered in the realm of "normal". They have surprising dynamic range. Don't forget, we're not talking about normal folks, were talking about Hi-Fi nuts.
 
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But more to the point of high Hi-Fi prices, I've seen and worked with items that retailed anywhere from 250% to 1200% markup over cost. It's all in what the market will bear.

Exactly, and that's not 'bad' in itself.
If someone shells out $ 250 for a boutique cap and maintains that it transforms his HiFi to the very best, that's a good deal for him.
Who cares that the cap was a $ 0.75 mass produced item with a shiny jacket and gold-lettered rebranding?
Value is exclusively determined by the buyer, NOT the seller, although ad people try their best.

jan
 
are we talking about hifi nuts? I got the impression this guy was pretty white bread. maybe thats my prejudice..meh.

yeah see my edit, I rephrased it to read discourse, nothing wrong with healthy discourse. but..

Pano, i'll save the quote above for an emergency and remind Mooly of your encouragement. did you really just accuse me of a deep seated reluctance, or complex about arguing? I feel sure i've received at least one warning from you in the past for arguing and more to the point, I received one today, so you'll forgive me if I have some reservations about argument...erm I mean conversation with 2 of my favorite mods. everyone has wanted a piece of me over the last couple of days, so i'm a bit on edge.

I love arguing :) its good for the mind and soul, to a point... as long as its in the right spirit.

the doors? I thought all you guys died out, or at least just started muttering incomprehensibly decades ago... Ha
 
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If someone shells out $ 250 for a boutique cap and maintains that it transforms his HiFi to the very best, that's a good deal for him.
Yes, and you'll find that a lot of us on this forum would not do so. We figure we are smarter than that. But we will spend a lot of money on out cherished Hi-Fi systems when most folks get along just great with a radio or a car stereo.

I don't think it should cost $250 to go see a concert, either, but thousands of people pay it. Rock-n-Roll and Opera are more about the show than the music, anyway. ;)
 
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