Film Cap For Exceptional Bass?

[calvert73]

Hi, I'd like to hear of anyones experience of film caps with exceptional bass performance, ie tight and tuneful not warm and cuddly. I use V-Caps in the mid/HF region of an active crossover but to use them in the bass section would make my bank manager faint. Are there any other specific capacitors at lower prices that perform exceptionally well in the Bass?

Please I'm looking for direct experience rather than opinion and if the opinion is 'all caps sound the same, use the cheapest dreck and it'll be cool' train of thought then please refrain from posting, I've seen how similar threads take a downward spiral ending in childish bickering and the spitting out of countless dummies (pacifiers)

RC

[wirewiggler]

It has been discussed to death ,do a little search you will find a lot of info. Unfortunately you will find all of it subjective.

Bill

[calvert73]

Hi, I did search here and other places as well as google, nothing specific to Bass, all subjective? What else is there? do you listen to or measure equipment. I do have quite a few caps here and I remember the days before audiophile caps, yes I'm aware that some 'audiophile' caps are just re-badged industrial products. I can assure you however that you would hear the difference between a V-Cap and a Solen PP, as to weather you would pony up the dough for the better cap, well thats down to the individual. I envy people who dont hear any differences between components and equipment for that matter, I'd love to be able to enjoy and be truly satisfied with a B&O system.
So anyone with direct experience of excellence in the Bass region with film caps?

RC

[AndrewT]

Hi,
make sure the high pass filter is low enough to let the full audio bandwidth to pass through.

Read D.Self on why the DC blocking cap in the NFB leg and the cap in the input high pass filter MUST be big enough to have negligible AC voltage across them.

Once you achieve those goals you can compare lots of different types of cheap caps to see if a preference starts to emerge.
You can also experiment with cheap bypass caps of alternative types to hear if they make any difference.

Once you have this data to hand you can decide which types and/or arrangements show most promise and start investing in the exotics of that type.

[analog_sa]

Are these crossovers commercial or diy? Can you not redesign them to use smaller values?

[calvert73]

Hi Andrew T, not quite certain I'm understanding what you mean by
"make sure the high pass filter is low enough to let the full audio bandwidth to pass through."

If I did that it would be a buffer not a filter, or do you mean the output caps?

The caps are required for the output of the filter itself and the buffer rather than the specific (small value) filter caps. I do tailor circuits to use small value capacitors but there are limits, due to internal circuit factors and external (power amp input Z), below which I cannot go.

I agree the active circuit is more important than passive components but just assume this is an excellent circuit, which allows me to hear the difference between the silly price V-Caps and everything else, because it does. If I told you how many film caps I have (mainly MKP mainstream electronics components) you'd faint, I have compared a lot of caps and there are (or have been) some truly great performers, which are not available in large values, otherwise I'd be using them.

Direct Experience anyone?

RC

[AndrewT]

Originally posted by calvert73
Hi Andrew T, not quite certain I'm understanding what you mean by
"make sure the high pass filter is low enough to let the full audio bandwidth to pass through."

If I did that it would be a buffer not a filter, or do you mean the output caps?

I'm referring to the power amp driving the bass speaker.

Are you referring to the caps in the active filter?

[analog_sa]

Originally posted by calvert73
Direct Experience anyone?

You are pretty much wasting your time asking this here. Tried the tweaker's asylum?

My experience with capacitors is quite limited as i mostly use types <$25/uF. A common feature of these caps is the improvement in bass if you manage to direct couple.

[calvert73]

As stated in the first post the caps are required for the Bass section of an active filter, specifically the output of the filter and the output of the buffer that follows the filter. The actual filter function caps are indeed some of those excellent industrial types I mentioned (now obselete). If I'm being good I aim for 3dB point at 0.2Hz, if not 2Hz (well everyone else does).

DC coupling, well I've been playing around with that one for 30 years, and owned plenty of exotic equipment that employed it but there are always issues of one sort or another, all said and done I prefer using a high quality cap, yet my system is configured to reduce the number of caps in the signal path.

Wasting my time, it looks like it, I dont ask many questions here so I was uncertain where to post but I'd like to thank you for your replies.

RC

[impsick]

Calvert, hey man if your worried about your bank manager fainting i would suggest checking out some Wego caps. They are German made, and specific for audio. Im only suggesting these because i've tried them and was impressed with the sound quality.


edit:
by the way they are electrolytic capacitors not film but to my ears sound better then some MKT caps i compared them to