Mains cables.Do they (and why)make any difference?

Panicos K · 8th November 2008, 09:24 PM

Hello,I was playing with some mains cables lately and I was surprised to see that my turntable which uses an outboard psu sounded much different depending on the mains cable I was trying on it.I could understand more easily why mains cables effect the performance of electronics but can anyone give me a few reasons why turntables could benefit from different mains cables?

dietcoke · 9th November 2008, 12:13 AM

Maybe your old cable was oxidized? Cheaply constructed with less than ideal gauge wire? Would you be able to notice the difference if someone did a blind test for you? If you cant measure any difference with a measuring device what you experienced was placebo.

Panicos K · 9th November 2008, 01:06 AM

All the mains cables I have tried were new and of large awg,14,12,11 and 10awg,stranded and solid cores.We have discussed in the past if cables make a difference or not,so this is not the issue.I respect someone's opinion that I(we)might be imagining things,but I also believe anyone who says he cannot hear any differences.As for those who say that there are no differences because you cannot measure any,I just don't want to say anything.It doesn't mean that my house is not on fire just because I cannot smell the smoke:-)In fact the microphone DID measure differences in bass extension and overall frequency linearity.I have chosen one of them after a score of 10/10 under a blind test,conducted by a friend of mine.The bass performance of the one I have chosen was so easy for me to tell and it was very much to my liking with my speakers(and rest of the system of course).
If anyone who believes that power cables do make a difference has an explanation,especially for the effect on turntables,then I would be glad to hear it please.
Just for the record,the one I prefered was a 12awg solid core.

cotdt · 9th November 2008, 01:10 AM

"unless we can monitor the difference between input and output at all levels and with normal signal applied, we really don't know what is going on. The usual tests are useful, but cannot predict how it will sound." -rod elliot's site

Magura · 9th November 2008, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Panicos K
Hello, can anyone give me a few reasons why turntables could benefit from mains cables?

Yes, they work better when powered

Magura

Panicos K · 9th November 2008, 04:41 PM

Magura,could this be the reason why my turntable's platter wasn't rotating?

planet10 · 9th November 2008, 04:56 PM

A couple good articles in the last 2 issues of affordable audio...

http://www.affordableaudio.org/

dave

analog_sa · 9th November 2008, 08:34 PM

Hi Panicos

IME mains cable makes a very perceptible difference on a tt with a syncronous or induction motor. Won't be surprised if the difference is even bigger with dc motors but i have no first hand experience. There may be a number of reasons, the most obvious being the filtration of harmonics by some cables. It's probably not so simple. Does anyone really have an answer for any of these effects?

Panicos K · 9th November 2008, 08:51 PM

Hi analog,thanks for your comments.I have not any valid answers on these effects,that is also the reason why I would like to hear opinions like yours.As you said,filtration of harmonics,good shielding and a couple of other factors perhaps,are beneficial.For me this was the first time to try mains cables on turntables and was really a surprise to hear such an obvious improvement-not just difference.And yes my Thorens turntable uses a syncronous motor.
Thanks for the link Dave.

PaleRider · 9th November 2008, 10:14 PM

There`s no magazines, no "experts" that really know the facts here. Well, except for me

Years ago I discovered the big benefit of using solid core cables. Not only for power, that was the last thing I discovered. On ultimate high-end equipment the gain is remarkable.

For power as well as speakercables I use this Swedish EKKJ cable that comes in real thick versions, and for bass-drivers driven by transistor-amps only the fattest are optimal.
EKKJ 2,5mm x3 gives a superb shielded solid core powercable:

https://www1.elfa.se/elfa~ex_en/b2b/start.do

8th November 2008, 09:24 PM	#1
Panicos K diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2006	Mains cables.Do they (and why)make any difference? Hello,I was playing with some mains cables lately and I was surprised to see that my turntable which uses an outboard psu sounded much different depending on the mains cable I was trying on it.I could understand more easily why mains cables effect the performance of electronics but can anyone give me a few reasons why turntables could benefit from different mains cables?

9th November 2008, 04:56 PM	#7
planet10 frugal-phile(tm) diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Victoria, BC, NA, Sol III Blog Entries: 5	A couple good articles in the last 2 issues of affordable audio... http://www.affordableaudio.org/ dave __________________ community sites t-linespeakers.org, frugal-horn.com, frugal-phile.com ........ commercial site planet10-HiFi p10-hifi forum here at diyA

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9th November 2008, 12:13 AM	#2
dietcoke diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: United States NY	Maybe your old cable was oxidized? Cheaply constructed with less than ideal gauge wire? Would you be able to notice the difference if someone did a blind test for you? If you cant measure any difference with a measuring device what you experienced was placebo.

9th November 2008, 01:06 AM	#3
Panicos K diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2006	All the mains cables I have tried were new and of large awg,14,12,11 and 10awg,stranded and solid cores.We have discussed in the past if cables make a difference or not,so this is not the issue.I respect someone's opinion that I(we)might be imagining things,but I also believe anyone who says he cannot hear any differences.As for those who say that there are no differences because you cannot measure any,I just don't want to say anything.It doesn't mean that my house is not on fire just because I cannot smell the smoke:-)In fact the microphone DID measure differences in bass extension and overall frequency linearity.I have chosen one of them after a score of 10/10 under a blind test,conducted by a friend of mine.The bass performance of the one I have chosen was so easy for me to tell and it was very much to my liking with my speakers(and rest of the system of course). If anyone who believes that power cables do make a difference has an explanation,especially for the effect on turntables,then I would be glad to hear it please. Just for the record,the one I prefered was a 12awg solid core.

9th November 2008, 01:10 AM	#4
cotdt diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2005	"unless we can monitor the difference between input and output at all levels and with normal signal applied, we really don't know what is going on. The usual tests are useful, but cannot predict how it will sound." -rod elliot's site

9th November 2008, 04:41 PM	#6
Panicos K diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2006	Magura,could this be the reason why my turntable's platter wasn't rotating?

9th November 2008, 08:34 PM	#8
analog_sa diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Sofia	Hi Panicos IME mains cable makes a very perceptible difference on a tt with a syncronous or induction motor. Won't be surprised if the difference is even bigger with dc motors but i have no first hand experience. There may be a number of reasons, the most obvious being the filtration of harmonics by some cables. It's probably not so simple. Does anyone really have an answer for any of these effects?

9th November 2008, 08:51 PM	#9
Panicos K diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2006	Hi analog,thanks for your comments.I have not any valid answers on these effects,that is also the reason why I would like to hear opinions like yours.As you said,filtration of harmonics,good shielding and a couple of other factors perhaps,are beneficial.For me this was the first time to try mains cables on turntables and was really a surprise to hear such an obvious improvement-not just difference.And yes my Thorens turntable uses a syncronous motor. Thanks for the link Dave.

9th November 2008, 10:14 PM	#10
PaleRider diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: home	There`s no magazines, no "experts" that really know the facts here. Well, except for me Years ago I discovered the big benefit of using solid core cables. Not only for power, that was the last thing I discovered. On ultimate high-end equipment the gain is remarkable. For power as well as speakercables I use this Swedish EKKJ cable that comes in real thick versions, and for bass-drivers driven by transistor-amps only the fattest are optimal. EKKJ 2,5mm x3 gives a superb shielded solid core powercable: https://www1.elfa.se/elfa~ex_en/b2b/start.do