I have found these to very nice caps.
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=404_5_305_163&products_id=1414
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=404_5_305_163&products_id=1414
But the instant that it does, it's no longer in audiophool category, isn't it?Miles Prower said:It's one of the few audiophool components that actually does what is claimed for it.
hifive said:Hi all,
I'm thinking to change my VTL monoblock capacitor to something better but Vcap is too expensive for me. Anyone can recommend through their experience in using the capacitors?.
rating 0.47k 400v
TQ
What's in there, now?
I expect those coupling caps. to be inside a NFB loop. If that's the case, "boutique" parts are unlikely to buy you a sonic improvement. A film and foil construction part, with good quality Copper leads, is quite sufficient inside a NFB loop. A nice 400 WVDC/470 nF. cap. is part of the Panasonic ECQ-P(U) series. You get Aluminum foil plates, polypropylene film dielectric, and Oxygen free Copper leads at a very attractive price.
Higher quality capacitors, incorporating dielectrics such as polyproplyene, polystyrene, teflon etc. in audio circuits are components that most engineers and builders seem to agree constitute as an improvement. While exactly how much, or which brand may be "best" are areas of discussion, the benefits of the components can actually be measured in terms of DF, ESR, and DA.
This is in contrast to any number of other audiofool components that are hustled at high prices to the unknowing, by opportunists that cannot provide any solid proof that their particular product provides a better final result.
This is in contrast to any number of other audiofool components that are hustled at high prices to the unknowing, by opportunists that cannot provide any solid proof that their particular product provides a better final result.
Required reading on this topic
http://members.aol.com/sbench102/caps.html
http://members.aol.com/sbench102/caps1.html
http://members.aol.com/sbench102/caps2.html
Gotta love 'em
http://members.aol.com/sbench102/caps.html
http://members.aol.com/sbench102/caps1.html
http://members.aol.com/sbench102/caps2.html
Colt45 said:I've always been a fan of cheapshit noname film caps.
Gotta love 'em
Caps info
Hi,
You may find a lot of info in the following sites:
http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html
http://www.tempoelectric.com/caps.htm
Extensive reviews of the most common caps used in Hi End.
F!
Hi,
You may find a lot of info in the following sites:
http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html
http://www.tempoelectric.com/caps.htm
Extensive reviews of the most common caps used in Hi End.
F!
My favorite are the Soviet mil-spec teflon caps which are available on ebay. From their silver plated terminals to their transparentness, they really are the best cap I have ever (not) heard. I put a set in one of my many amps last night and blew the lid off of the amp's sonic quality.
Here is an example:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350060896075
Here is an example:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=350060896075
It has almost become a mantra, but many capacitor manufacturers offer audiograde caps at slightly or terrible higher prices than the standard range. But many of these High End Audio Caps are just standard caps in a fancy blue or black "dress" with golden print and a different price tag. Don't get fooled!
soundbrigade said:But many of these High End Audio Caps are just standard caps in a fancy blue or black "dress" with golden print and a different price tag.
I demand that you show a proof or two on that.
Well, for some people that is.
A collegue from RIFA (tha capacitor factory in Sweden) worked for Ericsson as a components' engineer and often travelled to Japan and other parts of Asia.
He often asked the question about "Audio Grade Caps" and got this answer - same caps, different casings, different prices.
I also know that RIFA made a BIG electrolytic cap that interested the Car-Fi industry and on request RIFA delivered the standard cap in a black casing (instead of the standard grey) and with a price tag to the end users 3-4 times higher than the normal grey version.
He often asked the question about "Audio Grade Caps" and got this answer - same caps, different casings, different prices.
I also know that RIFA made a BIG electrolytic cap that interested the Car-Fi industry and on request RIFA delivered the standard cap in a black casing (instead of the standard grey) and with a price tag to the end users 3-4 times higher than the normal grey version.
In that case, those end users who claim to hear improvements, what's going on with them?soundbrigade said:A collegue from RIFA (tha capacitor factory in Sweden) worked for Ericsson as a components' engineer and often travelled to Japan and other parts of Asia.
He often asked the question about "Audio Grade Caps" and got this answer - same caps, different casings, different prices.
I also know that RIFA made a BIG electrolytic cap that interested the Car-Fi industry and on request RIFA delivered the standard cap in a black casing (instead of the standard grey) and with a price tag to the end users 3-4 times higher than the normal grey version.
Er well ....????
However. Some "better" electrolytics have a plastic piece in order to mechanically stabilize the foils so they can withstand higher mechanical forces and vibrations.
We also made experiments with polypropylene caps winding them with metalfoil (instead of metallized plastic foils), baking them longer to make the package very dense minimizing 3rd harmonic distortion that arises from cavitites between the windings. The latter is a major problem with paper-in-oil caps. Paper doesn't really shrink if heated. And if the paper-roll is pressed into an oval shape a lot of air cavities are created making the paper-cap useless for audio.
Another collegue from RIFA measured, btw, a distortion level of -140dB for one of the special caps we made bak then. That was the limits of the instruments.
However. Some "better" electrolytics have a plastic piece in order to mechanically stabilize the foils so they can withstand higher mechanical forces and vibrations.
We also made experiments with polypropylene caps winding them with metalfoil (instead of metallized plastic foils), baking them longer to make the package very dense minimizing 3rd harmonic distortion that arises from cavitites between the windings. The latter is a major problem with paper-in-oil caps. Paper doesn't really shrink if heated. And if the paper-roll is pressed into an oval shape a lot of air cavities are created making the paper-cap useless for audio.
Another collegue from RIFA measured, btw, a distortion level of -140dB for one of the special caps we made bak then. That was the limits of the instruments.
I've had good luck with Obbligato capacitors - cheap, are rated for 630V and they sound good (to my ears) too.
http://www.diyhifisupply.com/diyhs_ob_caps.htm
http://www.diyhifisupply.com/diyhs_ob_caps.htm
Humble Homemade Hifi
The Great Capacitor Shoot-Out
Extensive reviews of the most common caps used in Hi End.
And both sites go to great lengths to describe the number of veils that have been lifted by using one cap over another. "Bowling lane depth to the sound stage"... Gimme a break. While one site does show a simplified equivalent circuit model for a capacitor, it doesn't actually list those parameters for any of the tested caps -- even though, that's actually fairly easy to measure, provided that one has access to the right gear.
If you're going through the trouble and expense (assuming the authors of those sites actually did that and not just threw some verbiage together to get page hits) of testing all these caps, why not do it right? Perform a true blind A/B/X test on a large test subject group. Measure the caps. Correlate measured parameters with sonic performance.
Dozens of experiments have shown that more expensive looking products are perceived to sound better. Just like placebo medicine in some cases cures diseases. Psychosomatics and psychoacoustics are funny things.
Personally, I go for the Solen Fastcaps because they're well spec'ed and use polypropylene dielectric. They're fairly reasonably priced as well. I get mine through Antique Electronic Supply.
~Tom
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