I made some GS voltage and ID current tests and they are very similar to the datasheet.I will build a ZCA amplifier and compare the results.If they will behave stable and sound similar or better than Renesas mosfets i will keep the transistors.Or i will give them back.I have 82pcs.I will use 2 of them
Pretty sure I got a fake 2sk1058 from eBay. It was marked K1058, no manufacturers logo. The drain and source pins were the wrong way round; G D S instead of G S D. The Vgs was way too high at 3.43v and the input capacitance was 1600pf, should be 600pf max by the renesas data sheet. I paid 4.35 GBP ( about 6.50 USD )
I have another one on the way from a company in Thailand, it was only 4.99 USD so I'm not holding out too much hope with that either.
I seen that Cricklewood electronics here in the UK is selling the Renasas ones for 4.00 GBP and I know they are a reputable vendor, might try there next, meanwhile the ZCA project is on the back burner. I'm going to try out the MCA in the mean time.
Gordon.
I have another one on the way from a company in Thailand, it was only 4.99 USD so I'm not holding out too much hope with that either.
I seen that Cricklewood electronics here in the UK is selling the Renasas ones for 4.00 GBP and I know they are a reputable vendor, might try there next, meanwhile the ZCA project is on the back burner. I'm going to try out the MCA in the mean time.
Gordon.
Hi guys,
I bought 20 pairs of J162 and K1058 from Italy.
Markings highly indicate genuine stuff. Three circles, in one it says something with veryvery small text...I think Malaysia.
18 pairs are identical to the batch code and all and measure good. Gate capacitace is hundreds of pf, not thousands. Threshold voltage is around 0.5-0.6V
BUT, the 2 last pairs have different batch codes. K1058 measure ok and J162 not.
I did as you my dear friends advised me not do and bought the 15USD chinese component tester.
It is good for quick tests, not the most versatile instrument but pretty good.
On the ok FETs it says P- or N-E-MOS I guess E means enhancement mode.
On the bad J162 it says P-D-MOS, depletion?
Then it does not give threshold voltage and capacitance, but I0.12mA@Vg=84mV
When hooked up to a 30VDC PSU they conduct 7mA, "good ones" conduct 0mA
I bought 20 pairs of J162 and K1058 from Italy.
Markings highly indicate genuine stuff. Three circles, in one it says something with veryvery small text...I think Malaysia.
18 pairs are identical to the batch code and all and measure good. Gate capacitace is hundreds of pf, not thousands. Threshold voltage is around 0.5-0.6V
BUT, the 2 last pairs have different batch codes. K1058 measure ok and J162 not.
I did as you my dear friends advised me not do and bought the 15USD chinese component tester.
It is good for quick tests, not the most versatile instrument but pretty good.
On the ok FETs it says P- or N-E-MOS I guess E means enhancement mode.
On the bad J162 it says P-D-MOS, depletion?
Then it does not give threshold voltage and capacitance, but I0.12mA@Vg=84mV
When hooked up to a 30VDC PSU they conduct 7mA, "good ones" conduct 0mA
Attachments
Jilthen,
I live in Malaysia and I know Renases does have a semiconductor plant here. However fake parts are abound everywhere, especially in ebay where parts are mostly fakes especially those from China and Hongkong sellers. If you want genuine parts buy from reputable distributors like Farnell, RS , Digikey etc. There is one guy operating under Ampslab catering for the diy community and his parts are genuine Renasus. Price is very decent too!! my 2 cts..
I live in Malaysia and I know Renases does have a semiconductor plant here. However fake parts are abound everywhere, especially in ebay where parts are mostly fakes especially those from China and Hongkong sellers. If you want genuine parts buy from reputable distributors like Farnell, RS , Digikey etc. There is one guy operating under Ampslab catering for the diy community and his parts are genuine Renasus. Price is very decent too!! my 2 cts..
I mean gate connected to source. I think it does not work if you leave it hanging loose!
At least I have tried it with some power fet and audio fet and both were in a semi conductive state then...
I did not use any resistor at first...but now I added a 1k gate resistor.
VGS=-150mV (datasheet minimum threshold voltage) I get IDS = 28mA at VDS=30V.
So...possibly ok bias at VGS=-150mV...but not within datasheet specs.
Seller says he bought the FETs from a trustworthy electronics shop.
I believe him.
Same here in Finland, if I buy FETs from a shop here I think they are 99,99% likely to be genuine. The price is just too high.
Actually I was positively surprised when I saw this:
Partcon Verkkokauppa
15€/pair...not so bad. +9€ shipping I think.
I know the owner of the electronics store in my home town and he says he has sometimes encountered fakes but caught them before anyone has bought.
One time even somebody called him and warned that some bad batch had been stolen/taken.
Their suppliers are Farnell, RS, Elfa and TME.
TME is great, but due to their low prices I am a bit alert when buying from them. So far everything has been good stuff.
Got some 2SD2401-P from UK today, my cheapo tester says B=92. Tested with a bench PSU IBE=1mA I get ICE above 2A with VCE= 1.3V. Sounds good to me.
So it is clear that the cheapo tester cannot handle some darlingtons. (maybe due to the built in resistor in 2SD2401)
I think I may have gotten the genuine 2SD2401 but I will test more.
They are for a HK 3480 amplifier. Wonder if this china amp had genuine transistors when new...both channels blew when owner accidentally connected L+ to R+ on the speaker output. I think that is a bit weak. At least protection should work, unless protection is on the ground site, which it most likely is not.
At least I have tried it with some power fet and audio fet and both were in a semi conductive state then...
I did not use any resistor at first...but now I added a 1k gate resistor.
VGS=-150mV (datasheet minimum threshold voltage) I get IDS = 28mA at VDS=30V.
So...possibly ok bias at VGS=-150mV...but not within datasheet specs.
Seller says he bought the FETs from a trustworthy electronics shop.
I believe him.
Same here in Finland, if I buy FETs from a shop here I think they are 99,99% likely to be genuine. The price is just too high.
Actually I was positively surprised when I saw this:
Partcon Verkkokauppa
15€/pair...not so bad. +9€ shipping I think.
I know the owner of the electronics store in my home town and he says he has sometimes encountered fakes but caught them before anyone has bought.
One time even somebody called him and warned that some bad batch had been stolen/taken.
Their suppliers are Farnell, RS, Elfa and TME.
TME is great, but due to their low prices I am a bit alert when buying from them. So far everything has been good stuff.
Got some 2SD2401-P from UK today, my cheapo tester says B=92. Tested with a bench PSU IBE=1mA I get ICE above 2A with VCE= 1.3V. Sounds good to me.
So it is clear that the cheapo tester cannot handle some darlingtons. (maybe due to the built in resistor in 2SD2401)
I think I may have gotten the genuine 2SD2401 but I will test more.
They are for a HK 3480 amplifier. Wonder if this china amp had genuine transistors when new...both channels blew when owner accidentally connected L+ to R+ on the speaker output. I think that is a bit weak. At least protection should work, unless protection is on the ground site, which it most likely is not.
That kind of variation is abnormal. Even across six batches of IRFP9240 made by IR - sold by unscrupulous eBay vendor as match pairs, the max variation I observed is 25% or so - though I normally tend to match drain current at a given Vgs rather than Vgs(on).
The best way to test a lateral MOSFET is to observe drain current as the device warms up. Renesas app note has some information.
The eBay testers are good for to/no-go checks, but for anything more complex a proper test setupis probably needed.
Sometimes with gate open device may conduct quite a bit actually, I'm not sure of the mechanism behind it but I've seen drain current of up to 100mA that needs the G-S junction to be connected once and then 's fine. Only happens with devices that have been lying around for a bit or out of the box. A batch of 16 IRFP9140 from Digikey behaved like this, every single one of them.
The best way to test a lateral MOSFET is to observe drain current as the device warms up. Renesas app note has some information.
The eBay testers are good for to/no-go checks, but for anything more complex a proper test setupis probably needed.
Sometimes with gate open device may conduct quite a bit actually, I'm not sure of the mechanism behind it but I've seen drain current of up to 100mA that needs the G-S junction to be connected once and then 's fine. Only happens with devices that have been lying around for a bit or out of the box. A batch of 16 IRFP9140 from Digikey behaved like this, every single one of them.
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I used this url Electronic Parts Online Store - Tayda Electronics
and it's a perfectly legitimate web page with no rubbish on it !!
Wonder how you got all that 'porn' blurb !
and it's a perfectly legitimate web page with no rubbish on it !!
Wonder how you got all that 'porn' blurb !
I have bought from them many times and no problems, also NO sign of the porn links, I just checked ( viewed on Chrome on my samsung galaxy tab. ) Maybe you should run a virus scan autopoiesis.
Also, cool name ( I had to look up the meaning of the word!
)Gordon.
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same problem here
hi jlithen,
i have the same tester as you used on the 2Sj162, and i have the same result for 8 of 14 P-E-Mosfet, all 8 did show P-D-Mos instead of P-E-Mos and current Id of about 5 to 12 mA and the threshold voltages show from 50 mV to 120 mV. As i read in the firmware of this tester, a threshold voltage of <150mV is one indicator for a depletion Mosfet. All 9 pairs are original Hitachi 2SK1058/2SJ162 transistors with the same date code and about 20 years old, stored under dry and dark conditions.
The interesting thing is, that only the p-channel Fets show this misbehaviour.
For testing purposes, i equipped my evalution board, in working conditions with Renesas types of this Fets, and had the result that the P-Channel Mosfet was fully conduktive and i measured the negative rail voltage at the output of the board. So it is now a depletion MOSFET, but why???? Interseting also, that i measured a Rgs of about 18 Ohms
So i am a little confused, since these Transistors are genuine and only the P-channel Mosfet should be defective. Maybe a handling problem, or very high sensitive transistor for ESD.
Best regards
Günther
hi jlithen,
i have the same tester as you used on the 2Sj162, and i have the same result for 8 of 14 P-E-Mosfet, all 8 did show P-D-Mos instead of P-E-Mos and current Id of about 5 to 12 mA and the threshold voltages show from 50 mV to 120 mV. As i read in the firmware of this tester, a threshold voltage of <150mV is one indicator for a depletion Mosfet. All 9 pairs are original Hitachi 2SK1058/2SJ162 transistors with the same date code and about 20 years old, stored under dry and dark conditions.
The interesting thing is, that only the p-channel Fets show this misbehaviour.
For testing purposes, i equipped my evalution board, in working conditions with Renesas types of this Fets, and had the result that the P-Channel Mosfet was fully conduktive and i measured the negative rail voltage at the output of the board. So it is now a depletion MOSFET, but why???? Interseting also, that i measured a Rgs of about 18 Ohms
So i am a little confused, since these Transistors are genuine and only the P-channel Mosfet should be defective. Maybe a handling problem, or very high sensitive transistor for ESD.
Best regards
Günther
gasboss775 mentioned Cricklewood earlier; they provided my lifetime stock:
2SK1058 from Cricklewood Electronics
2SJ162 from Cricklewood Electronics
Both £4.25 + VAT, still in stock, Renesas TO-3P parts.
Mine appear to be genuine - case markings, dimensions, etc; those I've used perform very well.
AFAIK, Hitachi made these MOSFETs *only* in HPAK package:
N-Channel: 2SK225 (120V), 2SK226 (140V) ,2SK227 (160V)
P-Channel: 2SJ81 (-120V), 2SJ82 (-140V) ,2SJ83 (-160V)
From the Renesas datasheet: "The semiconductor operations of Mitsubishi Electric and Hitachi were transferred to Renesas Technology Corporation on April 1st 2003 [...]"
AFAIK, Renesas used Hitachi's dies, but *only* sold in TO-3P:
N-Channel: 2SK1056 (120V), 2SK1057 (140V), 2SK1058 (160V)
P-Channel: 2SJ160 (-120V), 2SJ161 (-140V), 2SJ162 (-160V)
View attachment Hitachi_Renesas_PowerFET_Dimensions.pdf
HTH,
AP
2SK1058 from Cricklewood Electronics
2SJ162 from Cricklewood Electronics
Both £4.25 + VAT, still in stock, Renesas TO-3P parts.
Mine appear to be genuine - case markings, dimensions, etc; those I've used perform very well.
AFAIK, Hitachi made these MOSFETs *only* in HPAK package:
N-Channel: 2SK225 (120V), 2SK226 (140V) ,2SK227 (160V)
P-Channel: 2SJ81 (-120V), 2SJ82 (-140V) ,2SJ83 (-160V)
From the Renesas datasheet: "The semiconductor operations of Mitsubishi Electric and Hitachi were transferred to Renesas Technology Corporation on April 1st 2003 [...]"
AFAIK, Renesas used Hitachi's dies, but *only* sold in TO-3P:
N-Channel: 2SK1056 (120V), 2SK1057 (140V), 2SK1058 (160V)
P-Channel: 2SJ160 (-120V), 2SJ161 (-140V), 2SJ162 (-160V)
View attachment Hitachi_Renesas_PowerFET_Dimensions.pdf
HTH,
AP
Hilariously, this is actually taken from your own web history. And put there by the malware your own computer has been tainted with, presumably from visiting the stuff that is being talked about.
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