Sub is almost done. Need to do some sanding and painting. Fun project and tested my skills to get all the bevels right with a $40 ryobi circular saw (with a lot nicer blade than came with it)
Any suggestions on enclosure volume/tuning for the tops with the Dayton 310-8 12" driver? It would make sense to tune them to be useable stand alone or with the mega sub.
Any suggestions on enclosure volume/tuning for the tops with the Dayton 310-8 12" driver? It would make sense to tune them to be useable stand alone or with the mega sub.
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Where possible, I tend to design in 2 (or more) possible port tuning frequencies with my designs.
If you use 1 longer port and 1 shorter, with both open the shorter port (with, say, an 80Hz tuning frequency) will be active, and provide a lot of output until the sub comes in.
If you block the short port, the longer one comes into play. Tune that for 50Hz or so. You'll likely need some boost to get it flat-to-50Hz, but it'll be reasonably full-range, without needing a sub. Max.SPL will take a hit, but it's perfect for smaller gigs.
Chris
If you use 1 longer port and 1 shorter, with both open the shorter port (with, say, an 80Hz tuning frequency) will be active, and provide a lot of output until the sub comes in.
If you block the short port, the longer one comes into play. Tune that for 50Hz or so. You'll likely need some boost to get it flat-to-50Hz, but it'll be reasonably full-range, without needing a sub. Max.SPL will take a hit, but it's perfect for smaller gigs.
Chris
I got it from post 774 here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subw...30-ft30-pa-th-awesomeness-78.html#post4376089
Crescendo built 4 and is happy with them so I figured why not?
Crescendo built 4 and is happy with them so I figured why not?
When you select max.SPL in Hornresp, it's telling you how loud the box can go at any given frequency. The red bits are excursion-limited, black bits are power limited.
It will not product that curve when you push the faders up, it'll keep the 2.8v curve, but move further up the screen until power compression etc kicks in.
You're meant to have a bump in displacement above the tuning frequency.
Chris
It will not product that curve when you push the faders up, it'll keep the 2.8v curve, but move further up the screen until power compression etc kicks in.
You're meant to have a bump in displacement above the tuning frequency.
Chris
Chris, thanks for the additional input. Increasing the input voltage produced the plots I was expecting to see....a smaller bump above the tuning frequency.
I think I am going to shoot for an enclosure with internal dimensions of 15 X 20 X 12 with tuning of 40Hz. 3" port should be enough to keep any chuffing at bay. There is a slight falling response down to 40. I am thinking keeping the phase change well below the xover frequency when using it with the sub is a good thing. Also I think I'll likely use them more frequently without the sub but that remains to be seen. Also, I think the SPL with this configuration is acceptable, so I don't think I am going to go after dual tuning.
I would be cutting the wood this weekend however I have houseguests....so if there are other things I need to consider that would push the tuning freq up let me know.
I think I am going to shoot for an enclosure with internal dimensions of 15 X 20 X 12 with tuning of 40Hz. 3" port should be enough to keep any chuffing at bay. There is a slight falling response down to 40. I am thinking keeping the phase change well below the xover frequency when using it with the sub is a good thing. Also I think I'll likely use them more frequently without the sub but that remains to be seen. Also, I think the SPL with this configuration is acceptable, so I don't think I am going to go after dual tuning.
I would be cutting the wood this weekend however I have houseguests....so if there are other things I need to consider that would push the tuning freq up let me know.
Was borderline unhappy with the Dayton PA310-8 there was a few resonances that just made it sound off. I figured it might be the enclosure so I got some acoustical foam panels from amazon and lined the inside of the enclosure. Much happier with the sound. I do have to add quite a bit of boost to the low end to use the speakers without the sub. Also I resigned myself to using the ugly waffle grilles as they are off the shelf and inexpensive.
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(Almost) zero-cost tweaks...
I'm a fan of two tweaks one can do to a horn or waveguide that * may * improve its performance:
1. the "towel trick" = a lip at the mouth of the horn intended to break up the reflections that can cause "horn honk" or other bad sound.
2. the Geddes foam plug: either the "recommended" 30 PPI reticulated foam (expensive) or my "ghetto" version -- polyfill or similar batting . This is supposed to reduce "higher order modes."
Many claim either or both these tweaks can dramatically improve a horn's sound -- at a cost of slight HF reduction. Unless you need to melt the ear wax in your listeners' ears, you should be able add a little HF boost to compensate.
Other than appearance issues, may I point out both these tweaks cost almost nothing to try?
I'm a fan of two tweaks one can do to a horn or waveguide that * may * improve its performance:
1. the "towel trick" = a lip at the mouth of the horn intended to break up the reflections that can cause "horn honk" or other bad sound.
2. the Geddes foam plug: either the "recommended" 30 PPI reticulated foam (expensive) or my "ghetto" version -- polyfill or similar batting . This is supposed to reduce "higher order modes."
Many claim either or both these tweaks can dramatically improve a horn's sound -- at a cost of slight HF reduction. Unless you need to melt the ear wax in your listeners' ears, you should be able add a little HF boost to compensate.
Other than appearance issues, may I point out both these tweaks cost almost nothing to try?
UPDATE: New Components
OK, after going through all the threads, the design requirements changed. Instead of super narrow and trying to array the speaker, I've switched to a 100x40 horn, and will stack them with horns together if more volume is needed. Seems much more sane. Also, eliminated the internal crossovers and went biamped. I now just need to figure out the power requirements to buy some amps. Will probably use the iNuke 1000 + iNuke 3000, or iNuke 3000 + iNuke 6000, coupled with a Behringer DCX2496 crossover.
Here is the new parts list. I have also updated the original post. It now comes in just over $200/cabinet! Excited to build these.
OK, after going through all the threads, the design requirements changed. Instead of super narrow and trying to array the speaker, I've switched to a 100x40 horn, and will stack them with horns together if more volume is needed. Seems much more sane. Also, eliminated the internal crossovers and went biamped. I now just need to figure out the power requirements to buy some amps. Will probably use the iNuke 1000 + iNuke 3000, or iNuke 3000 + iNuke 6000, coupled with a Behringer DCX2496 crossover.
Here is the new parts list. I have also updated the original post. It now comes in just over $200/cabinet! Excited to build these.
Code:
Part # Description Price Quan Ext
295-032 Dayton Audio PA310-8 12" Pro Woofer $66.75 1 $66.75
270-406 Dayton Audio DT250P-8 1" Polyimide Compression Horn Driver $42.95 1 $42.95
245-324 PA Knock-Down Trapezoid Plywood Speaker Cabinet $69.00 1 $69.00
294-2912 PRV Audio WG23-25 1" 100 x 40 Waveguide $5.99 1 $5.99
262-348 Penn-Elcom M1504 ABS Dish Two Neutrik D or NL4MP $1.30 1 $1.30
262-824 Parts Express Plastic Pocket Speaker Cabinet Handle 4-Sided $3.97 2 $7.94
092-052 Neutrik NL4MP Speakon Connector 4 Pole Panel Mount $2.25 2 $4.50
260-773 Penn-Elcom F1633 Rubber Cabinet Foot 1.125" Dia. x 0.5" H $0.46 4 $1.84
245-013 Penn-Elcom M1551 Steel Speaker Mounting Top Hat $7.19 1 $7.19
Total: $207.46
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That all sounds pretty good....I'd consider the Eminence H290 waveguide as it is cheapish and very similar to Wayne Parhams H290C, which is the best sounding low cost waveguide I've heard by quite a margin. I've also become a fan of the PRV D290py....Noticeably better than the Dayton and can be crossed lower. If you can get closer to 1k you're not going to have as much blooming through the crossover. I use them at 1k 24LR with SEOS or Wayne's horn and they sound very good. iNuke 3000 and 1000 should be fine. Check out the DSP models and you won't need the DCX2496.
Thanks for the info! I already have the dcx2496 for my PAL12 sub duty, so I figured I'd just change it to a 3-way config.
On the way...
Ok, this is on the way, will be here Monday. I'm just building one for testing, then will build 3 more if I'm happy
Ok, this is on the way, will be here Monday. I'm just building one for testing, then will build 3 more if I'm happy
Code:
Product Name Sku Qty Price Total
Parts Express Plastic Pocket Speaker Cabinet Handle 4-Sided 262-824 2 $3.97 $7.94
Penn-Elcom M1504 ABS Dish Two Neutrik D or NL4MP 262-348 1 $1.30 $1.30
Penn-Elcom F1633 Rubber Cabinet Foot 1.125" Dia. x 0.5" H 260-773 4 $0.46 $1.84
Penn-Elcom M1551 Steel Speaker Mounting Top Hat for 1-3/8" Tripod Stand 245-013 1 $7.19 $7.19
Dayton Audio PA310-8 12" Pro Woofer 295-032 1 $66.75 $66.75
Neutrik NL4MP Speakon Connector 4 Pole Panel Mount 092-052 2 $2.25 $4.50
PA Knock-Down Trapezoid Plywood Speaker Cabinet for 12" Driver 245-324 1 $69.00 $69.00
Dayton Audio DT250P-8 1" Polyimide Compression Horn Driver 270-406 1 $42.95 $42.95
PRV Audio WG23-25 1" 100 x 40 Waveguide 1-3/8"-18 TPI 294-2912 1 $5.99 $5.99- Status
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