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Einric 24th March 2013 02:07 AM

Best Replacement For Behringer ED MX2442A
 
Recently my Church was vandalized and they dumped water in the Mixer.
Power was applied to the mixer before we realized there was water inside.
Needless to say it did not turn out well.

What would be a good replacement for this, possibly digital (not a requirement) with a budget of about $3000usd?
They might also look into a Feedback Destroyer for a room EQ.

Thank You,
Rich

djcgtr 25th March 2013 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Einric (Post 3424620)
Recently my Church was vandalized and they dumped water in the Mixer.
Power was applied to the mixer before we realized there was water inside.
Needless to say it did not turn out well.

What would be a good replacement for this, possibly digital (not a requirement) with a budget of about $3000usd?
They might also look into a Feedback Destroyer for a room EQ.

Thank You,
Rich

Hi Rich

Perhaps providing a bit of info will help your decision.

- With a $3000 budget, there is a myriad of consoles new or even used that could be good for your application. Are there any shortcomings in the rest of your system at the facility and should budget be considered for a replacement console AND other things or ??....within a 3 K budget

- You mention digital. Are the operators of the system up to the task of using a digital instead of the analog console you had damaged by intruders ?

- What is your current channel usage and what, if any, prediction for the future regarding number of mic or DI inputs, besides any inputs from sources local to the mixer location ?

- Did the B******* mixer function ok for you during the time it was in service ?

As far as a feedback destroyer - what is currently in use on the main system as far as EQ ? Do you have feedback issues often ? And do you use monitors on stage ?


regards
Deric

Enzo 25th March 2013 04:59 AM

Agree with what Deric said.

I too must ask: did the Behringer work well before the incident? Certainly a new Behringer board would fit in your budget. And everyone there is already familiar with it. WHy not just get another one of the same type? Peavey makes a good range of boards, there are any number of brands of good mixers.

Is there anything special about your situation? It is easy to spend more than you neeed to adding features you really do not need. For example digital. WHy would digital be desirable in your situation? It might allow you to export tracks to a computer and do editing, but is that something you would even do?

In my humble opinion, digital mixers are less friendly to the unskilled operator. If you run an analog mixer into the red, it might distort a little. And you might never hear a little distortion there. You run digital mixers into the red, and you can get godawful noises. A digital converter has only so many bits to work with, and when you run past its little limit, it makes up numbers that don't make auditory sense.

Einric 25th March 2013 11:10 PM

Yes the EuroDesk 2442 worked fine and fit the bill perfectly.
We do have 2 stage monitors in use we also have two "Performance" speakers that are imbedded into the walls above the "Stage".
My Pastor seems to think that 16CH would not be enough so we are looking at atleast 24CH replacement.
We don't currently have any EQ to speak of but the sound folks upstairs seem to have problems adjusting things from the small booth upstairs.
They like the idea of the digital mixer because of the remote control functions.
Digital mixer is not a hard requirement.
The sound room folks would like to have some way to EQ the room and I had just mentioned the Feedback Destroyer as a possible solution.

Enzo 26th March 2013 02:28 AM

Feedback fighters do exactly that. They find feedback notes and attenuate those notes. They are not made to tune a room and even out frequency response. They only kill feedback. But if you want to tune the system to the room, just get a graphic equalizer and tune the room. A graphic shouldn;t cost any more than a feedback ferret.

A quick look shows new Behringer mixers SX4882 $1500, SX3242 $600. Same source has Peavey PV32FX $1100 and PV24FX $1000. (Looking at Musicians Friend) So your $3000 budget has LOTS of room for a mixer. Some of the PV mixers have a feedback ferret feature built right in. And Mackie makes nice mixers, I always liked SOundcraft mixers. There are other nice ones too.

djcgtr 26th March 2013 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Einric (Post 3427323)
Yes the EuroDesk 2442 worked fine and fit the bill perfectly.
We do have 2 stage monitors in use we also have two "Performance" speakers that are imbedded into the walls above the "Stage".
My Pastor seems to think that 16CH would not be enough so we are looking at atleast 24CH replacement.
We don't currently have any EQ to speak of but the sound folks upstairs seem to have problems adjusting things from the small booth upstairs.
They like the idea of the digital mixer because of the remote control functions.
Digital mixer is not a hard requirement.
The sound room folks would like to have some way to EQ the room and I had just mentioned the Feedback Destroyer as a possible solution.

Hi Rich

You did provide some useful information. Since you feel the console that was damaged "fit the bill" I believe a similar unit can work ok. Enzo has offered some selections to look into for replacement. Buy once, cry once.

Before selecting a channel count, what all are you doing with regard to the current and future intentions on inputs ? Do you have contemporary services or perhaps an added traditional style service ?

Was the current system specified and installed by a pro or was it an "in house" spec and installation ? And the main speakers, are they proper for best dispersion and aim to the seating area ? Are microphones essentially behind and out of the main speaker coverage ?

There is so much that could be covered by a visit from a local area pro installer. It is difficult to ascertain all the variables in a forum discussion.
Room dimensions including ceiling height, how much hard reflective surfaces do you have, do affect the performance of a system.

I suggest to avoid using any type of "drive rack" style processor to "auto EQ" the system for the room. The "auto EQ" is not going to give you the results you might think it would...
These processors do have capabilities of not only graphic EQ but also have parametric options. Depending on your overall circumstances, this type of device may be a consideration. Any tool is only as good as the operator and would require a respectable level of knowledge to maximize the capabilities.

If you only acquire an EQ for dialing the system, use a 1/3 octave at bare minimum. Wider bandwidth on the EQ filters of less than 29 to 31 actual or virtual slider adjustments, will not serve you well. Once a system EQ is adjusted for best results, the fun part is keeping fingers away from the settings, and I do not only mean inquisitive children....

Pastor mic - is this a fixed podium mic or lav or ?? Lavs can be quite a challenge for gain before feedback, even with a well behaved system. I have often recommended ear set style mics that keep close proximity to the mouth and subsequently reduces needed gain. Especially helpful for "roaming" pastors even out into the seating area...

The option of wireless remote mixing is a tempting concept and obviously requires the equipment to do just that. With a sound control space that is not in the seating area, it is difficult to mix.

Sufficient volume and clarity is a primary need for the spoken word in a H.O.W. There is much to consider when striving to achieve that goal.

We can assist on what we can, but nothing takes the place of being there to globally assess your venue.

carry on
Deric

Einric 26th March 2013 01:20 PM

Our service hall is not very large, we can only seat 150people TOPS.
The floor is carpeted with a very short type of carpet.
Ceiling is 16 feet and the room is about 60'x70'.
The two main monitors are about 3 feet in front of where the Pastor "roams" around.
He mostly uses a fixed podium but we also have a couple of Lapel Mic's and 1 or 2 Ear Mic's.
I did notice the Peavey S-24 with an integrated Feedback Stopper that looks like it has churches in mind for the design.

djcgtr 27th March 2013 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Einric (Post 3428025)
Our service hall is not very large, we can only seat 150people TOPS.
The floor is carpeted with a very short type of carpet.
Ceiling is 16 feet and the room is about 60'x70'.
The two main monitors are about 3 feet in front of where the Pastor "roams" around.
He mostly uses a fixed podium but we also have a couple of Lapel Mic's and 1 or 2 Ear Mic's.
I did notice the Peavey S-24 with an integrated Feedback Stopper that looks like it has churches in mind for the design.

The S-24 might be your answer. I have not personally used this line of the Peavey mixers

I will try this at another angle here.
I am curious, what all will be on the mixer inputs ?...what inputs do you plan on the need for 24 channels ?

east electronics 27th March 2013 07:18 AM

keep in mind that the previous 2442 was a very rugged device , clubs theaters and so on still work with it over here problem free . Sorry to say that now days and especially with SX series of Behringer there is holly lot new functions and abilities but the manufacturing is far less rugged . A lot of problems even with brand new boards .

Go for a Yamaha given the task .While both Behringer and Yamaha is on the mild soft side of sound Peavey Soundcraft and maybe Dynacord will perform the best in harder sounds like a rock band .

Kind regards
Sakis

Einric 27th March 2013 01:20 PM

All of our inputs will be pretty standard stuff.
We have a few Mic's, Acoustic Guitar, Electric Bass & a Yamaha Keyboard.
I myself doubt that we need a 24+ channel mixer but the Church leadership would rather buy more than they need and grow into it.


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