Silver hookup wire mystery..bad one..

[JandG]

I established a xo configuration I was happy with on my OB 3 ways..had test clips in play from end of very nice speaker cables off a nice tube amp. & test clips throughout the simple XO circuit &.decided to hard wire it all together with 24ga 4n silver in cotton I had stashed. soldered it all up & am not happy..bright..to much detail persay..but the biggy is my mid bass is gone 150-300hz..Is this because of going to such a light ga wire..It is a simple XO 1-.22uf coil on Fullranger & 1-2uf cap on ribbon, tubeamp is highpassed 1st order @ 150hz. I run plate amps for the bass drivers & set @ 150hz 4th..I am thinking if I go to 14ga I will be fine. This was a big nasty surprise. I am not into all the cable games,, but something is seriously amiss..I will re-wire this weekend,, but would like a opinion..

[Cloth Ears]

Sorry JandG,

Difficult to read your post.
You went from one sort of cable with test clips (crimped or soldered) to 24ga 4n silver in cotton? Was this 2 runs of cable (one to the fullranger and one to the ribbon) or 1 run? Is the crossover a series or parallel type?

I'm guessing you haven't played with the bass-drivers/amps/high-pass...right?

Have (had) you tried using the same clips with the new wire before soldering? Does this improve it? Without wanting to diss your soldering skills, a bad solder can cause the sort of thing you've found, especially with a series crossover. I'd be surprised if it was happening on both channels unless it was a problem with the wire, though.

[MadMutt]

If you've moved the physical location of the parts, that will affect it's performance. (inductor interaction)
Also I have found that a soldered joint is indeed very different to clip leads.

I'm more of a hard wired point to point type of guy

Less joints = less things to go wrong (in theory).....

[joe carrow]

24 ga is very small wire- have you measured the resistance of the wire? Honestly, the whole point of using something like silver is to have extremely low resistance- and it's only slightly better than copper.

Having tiny wire is like having a resistor in line with your speakers. It will destroy whatever damping factor your amp has.

[analog_sa]

Originally posted by JandG
I am not into all the cable games,,

Some silver wire sounds exactly like you describe it - bright, no bass. Very extended break-in may help, especially if you use a break-in device.

I would rather forget about this wire and either try copper or some better quality silver. Don't ask me what better quality means, whether it's annealing or surface polishing, no idea, but some silver sounds really good.

The mid bass isn't silver's forte anyway.

[joe carrow]

Sorry, but you can't be seriou- nevermind, no good can come of my response to this kind of thread.





Having had a bad day, here goes...

<rant>
Wire is a well understood thing, used to create things as complex as supercomputers and space shuttles, transmit power in the millions of watts or millionths of watts. If different wire materials had major effects on audio transmission beyond resistance, inductance, and capacitance, then the engineering texts would bear that out.
</rant>

[janneman]

If the result is so disastrous ("the mid bass was gone"), my bet is a wiring error. Small gauge wire will make a difference, but not on just 1 foot or two, and not to that effect.

Jan Didden

[EC8010]

Sounds like the midrange is out of phase with the bass, creating cancellation at the crossover frequency.

[JandG]

I will check circuit again this weekend when I get back home to make sure no erroe is present. I am fairly sure that this is noe though. The light wire seems to be the culprit I would guess. It is a all open baffle setup. The bass driver & amps are the same as the were 14ga, they are o.k...the B200 & ribbon are what I changed. They were clipped to the ends of Zu Libtec's that I had for years..the longest run of the 24ga is about 5' & I even soldered to tyhe B200's but not the ribbon, termination on those..I only used the silver cuz I had it, I usually just use it in cd players, DAC & such in just a couple inch use for signal paths sometimes. I bet I need the resistance in the OB system, makes sence to me..I am going back to at least 18ga, naybe even bigger, & copper only, maybe dang lamp cord, anythig..the light wire is a goner..I didn't think such a short runs would matter..It is only the mid bass from 150-300 that is having the problem..I will remove it all & repport back. I have lots of copper..Thanks for the heads up on the damping factor, makes total sence & behaviour shows this what it probablly is..I will quadrupal check circuit also, to make sure nothing is a miss..Thanks to all....

[analog_sa]

Originally posted by JandG
Thanks for the heads up on the damping factor, makes total sence & behaviour shows this what it probablly is..

Yup, that's surely it.

If you do the calcs you may even find 0.1db difference, though i doubt it.