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Old 14th March 2007, 09:16 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zaph
Hi Joe,

Thanks for posting the test results. As far as I can tell, you're the first to test one of the new versions. I'll be paying close attention to any other results you post. I'd be especially grateful if you could post an accurate unsmoothed response plot, either infinite baffle or a well defined baffle of some type. If you have the ability to test for sensitivity, it would also be good to know what the 2.83 V SPL is.

Regards,
John
Hi John,

Can you see any physical differences between Joe's samples and your own? Could it just be manufacturing tolerences. That H2 plateu looks rather strange considering, would you attribute this to SS voicing the driver?
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Old 14th March 2007, 09:17 PM   #22
AJinFLA is offline AJinFLA  United States
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Here is another test of this tweeter
D3004-6600

cheers,

AJ
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Old 14th March 2007, 11:53 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by ShinOBIWAN

That H2 plateu looks rather strange considering, would you attribute this to SS voicing the driver?
This is also my question. BOTH samples indicate it is not a single faulty driver.

I only have these for another day, it's mid morning here and have to return them first thing tomorrow morning. Later today will do a series of tests and then post results.

Joe R.
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Old 15th March 2007, 12:04 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by Joe Rasmussen
I only have these for another day, it's mid morning here and have to return them first thing tomorrow morning. Later today will do a series of tests and then post results.

Joe R.
Thanks Joe and I'm sure others appreciate the effort. Look forward to the results.
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Old 15th March 2007, 12:58 AM   #25
Zaph is offline Zaph  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by ShinOBIWAN


Hi John,

Can you see any physical differences between Joe's samples and your own? Could it just be manufacturing tolerences. That H2 plateu looks rather strange considering, would you attribute this to SS voicing the driver?
Visually they look the same. Joe's might have a little shinier coating but that might just be the light.

I think a highish 2nd order HD is just typical of this type of tweeter. All other tweeters from this family that I've tested behave similarly. (XT25, 7100, DX25) It's a fair trade for the lower tall order products.

I might suspect higher 2nd order HD for any driver having the surround contribute a greater portion to overall output.
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Old 15th March 2007, 03:05 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zaph
I think a highish 2nd order HD is just typical of this type of tweeter. All other tweeters from this family that I've tested behave similarly. (XT25, 7100, DX25) It's a fair trade for the lower tall order products.

I might suspect higher 2nd order HD for any driver having the surround contribute a greater portion to overall output.
I've listened to distortion tests which added the same amount of distortion to various harmonics. It took a lot more 2nd order to be noticeable than 3rd order and even more so for higher orders, as one would expect from masking theory.

As it turns out, taking a bit more 2nd order distortion for reduced higher order products is a useful tradeoff in other ways, since 2nd order Volterra filters are considerably less complicated than higher orders. Here are some abstracts:

http://citeseer.ist.psu.edu/11715.html
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=14175313
http://www.ee.kth.se/php/modules/pub...S3-SB-0451.pdf

Volterra filters do have costs, however: they must be tuned to the precise driver used, because unit manufacturing variations will render the DSP useless, or possibly degrade performance. The processing sampling rate must also be at least twice the normal sampling rate to keep nonlinearities from aliasing around the Nyquist frequency into the passband.

Long story short, they're good for high-end work, where the manufacturer can take the time to tune each filter to the particular set of drivers, but they'd be uneconomical to implement for cheap speakers.
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Old 15th March 2007, 03:51 AM   #27
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Joe,

WES Components (the sole Australian distributor for Tymphany), were due to receive stock of the 6600 last July, however I never followed that up (may have arrived later)

In Australia, I wouldn't be surprised if you actually received an "06 model", even though WES confess that they've just received newer/more stock. The reverse has happened to me in the past- I wanted old stock, WES sent new stock, followed by confusion, multiple phone calls back and forth etc)

Due to a variety of factors (smaller market share, relatively high prices, complete lack of advertising) it's likely that these tweeters have never sold well, and it's likely WES never had the "out of stock" problem that Madisound or other US distributors experienced.

I guess we won't be able to put this to rest, until you or John test another sample, but by the off-chance,

Do you have a batch number of your pair?

I've had batch numbers on all ScanSpeak drivers, and although only Tymphany's internal database can extract the exact production date, we can make some inferences whether yours was made before, after or much later than John or Mark's.
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Old 15th March 2007, 05:14 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by tktran303
Joe,

WES Components (the sole Australian distributor for Tymphany), were due to receive stock of the 6600 last July...

In Australia, I wouldn't be surprised if you actually received an "06 model", even though WES confess that they've just received newer/more stock...

I guess we won't be able to put this to rest, until you or John test another sample, but by the off-chance..

Do you have a batch number of your pair?

It was made clear to me that this pair was delayed because of Tymphany and some 'finishing' - such as the 'finish' (look?) wasn't right. Let's say they are receiving the front plate from a different source and it looks wrong (it has a mat finish) , or the perspex(?) rear also looked bad... that was the kind of problem they were inferring.

This pair is NOT from WES, but direct from Tymphany - to a loudspeaker manufacturer. Also, if you have problems with WES, make note (hush-hush) the boss' name is Peter Carlini (known him a LONG time), don't mention my name to him, at least not in that context! He doesn't like getting pestered.

But he says that there was TWO deliveries dates last year and nothing came of it. The reason? "Production problems!" Maybe those mat front plates? They have no date when they will get them.

Re batch number, you saw the photos? See any? Nope. These are clearly samples, but how representative are they when REAL production units come on stream? I was told this pair was one of only two pairs sent to Australia (not WES). Are THESE the REAL deal? With a little luck, my source who lent these to me will get more later and we can explore and reach a firmer conclusion. Also, this pair will be installed into a prototype speaker box - but that may some weeks off, before we get an idea how they sound.

As I have to return these tomorrow I am running a batch of distortion tests right now and will post asap.

Joe R.
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Old 15th March 2007, 01:50 PM   #29
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Hi Joe,

Thanks for your expanded explanation. I think it's safe to say I can stop speculating any further.

best regards,
Thanh.
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Old 16th March 2007, 03:26 PM   #30
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Default versus Scan-Speak D2905/970000 ?

Hi Joe,
as you say the Peerless HDS 810921 is currently your favorite tweeter, and you seem to have some experience with ScanSpeak drivers, have you compared the Peerless 810921 with the older and much liked by DIYers Scan D2905/970000 ?

Yes, I see the 810921 has higher sensitivity and higher Fs than the D2905/970000, though within a sensibly chosen operating bandwidth and power for the Scan I am wondering how both compare for harmonic distortions and what-ever delayed decaying resonances, etc ...

Have you ever tested the D2905/970000, and made any plots or other measurements from it that you are able to publish here, or have any other comments to make about it, eg:- sample variations, etc ... ???

Regards,
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