No bitumen or "heavy wall damping" as you say. The only damping is on the same page that shows wiring:
Elsinore Wiring
Cheers.
Joe R.
Thanks Joe, I am almost hooked
I don't have access to Dacron, but I used Sonofil from Intertechnik in the past which seems to have similar density. The problem is that it comes in only one thickness which is 40mm, so I will have some trouble making it thinner.
What about the quality of the tweeter cap? I am thinking of using inexpensive Audyn MKT. I know everyone seems to like expensive caps in series with tweeter, but I don't know how much this really matters in real life.
I don't have access to Dacron, but I used Sonofil from Intertechnik in the past which seems to have similar density. The problem is that it comes in only one thickness which is 40mm, so I will have some trouble making it thinner.
What about the quality of the tweeter cap? I am thinking of using inexpensive Audyn MKT. I know everyone seems to like expensive caps in series with tweeter, but I don't know how much this really matters in real life.
Quallity caps in series DO matter. But who says they have to be expensive
tjek this out. Humble Homemade Hifi
I'm using Carity caps SA MKP. they only cost a fraction more than the Audyn caps your using and they are fantastik
tjek this out. Humble Homemade Hifi
I'm using Carity caps SA MKP. they only cost a fraction more than the Audyn caps your using and they are fantastik
Quallity caps in series DO matter. But who says they have to be expensive...
I'm using Carity caps SA MKP. they only cost a fraction more than the Audyn caps your using and they are fantastik
I have been using ClarityCap ESA 0.22uF/630V as coupling caps in my tube amps and they are very nice indeed. Would also do pretty good in the Elsinores I suspect. While more expensive than SA they are still very good value.
Cheers.
Joe R.
I buy them at HiFi DIY products and accessories - Welcome - gato-shop.com
They are the cheapest place i could find. They have fast and good service. Plus very cheap shipping(at least in Denmark)
Bonus info. The SA series is also used in Neeper's Perfection One speaker. that also says something about the quallity of the caps. Because they sound amazing
They are the cheapest place i could find. They have fast and good service. Plus very cheap shipping(at least in Denmark)
Bonus info. The SA series is also used in Neeper's Perfection One speaker. that also says something about the quallity of the caps. Because they sound amazing
Thanks Joe, I am almost hooked
I don't have access to Dacron, but I used Sonofil from Intertechnik in the past which seems to have similar density. The problem is that it comes in only one thickness which is 40mm, so I will have some trouble making it thinner.
What about the quality of the tweeter cap? I am thinking of using inexpensive Audyn MKT. I know everyone seems to like expensive caps in series with tweeter, but I don't know how much this really matters in real life.
Hmm. I am trying to think. Assuming the density is about right, the back three pieces should be double 40mm = 80mm layer. Using the weight as a guide that should weigh about 400gr and a bit - and no more than 500gr max?
I looked at the link you gave and you say 40mm thick, but the size is not shown and no weight. Otherwise I could have helped a bit more?
Cheers.
Joe R.
Here's the link. There used to be a datasheet for it, but cannot find it there anymore:
IT Speaker Shop - SONOFIL/W/SB | Damping :: Accessories and Miscellaneous ::
Found the full specs, but there is no density info:
Intertechnik Dämmatten Sonofil SO/1/W (IT1343336) bei Trenkenchu & Stadler GbR
There is a link to pdf on the bottom.
Intertechnik Dämmatten Sonofil SO/1/W (IT1343336) bei Trenkenchu & Stadler GbR
There is a link to pdf on the bottom.
Response vs accuracy of inductors; is 4% close enough?
I am making progress on my Elsinores, currently working on my cross-overs. My question is how accurate should the inductors be? And what effect do they have on the response curve it they are not accurate, i.e. how sensitive is the response to inaccuracy in inductor values?
Initially I bought inductors form one supplier and received inductors that were within 4 % of the specified inductance, except for the 0.47mH and 0.82mH inductors with were not well-balanced and on average about 6% and 9% too low.
The discrepancies on these two pairs seemed unacceptable and I ordered another set from a second very reputable dealer. This time both pairs were well-balanced, the .82 pair right on the nose in value, and he 0.47 pair about 4% too high.
I could unroll some of the coils and probably get the value quite close to the spec value of 0.47. My real question is it worth the trouble? Or is 4% too high "close enough"? What effect will this have on the Elsinore's response?
I am making progress on my Elsinores, currently working on my cross-overs. My question is how accurate should the inductors be? And what effect do they have on the response curve it they are not accurate, i.e. how sensitive is the response to inaccuracy in inductor values?
Initially I bought inductors form one supplier and received inductors that were within 4 % of the specified inductance, except for the 0.47mH and 0.82mH inductors with were not well-balanced and on average about 6% and 9% too low.
The discrepancies on these two pairs seemed unacceptable and I ordered another set from a second very reputable dealer. This time both pairs were well-balanced, the .82 pair right on the nose in value, and he 0.47 pair about 4% too high.
I could unroll some of the coils and probably get the value quite close to the spec value of 0.47. My real question is it worth the trouble? Or is 4% too high "close enough"? What effect will this have on the Elsinore's response?
No, don't unroll - the second lot seems quite satisfactory. Basically, even 5% is not that bad. I have done some modelling to see how sensitive various components are differing values and not too sensitive. For example if you by mistake you ended up using 0.33mH where 0.47mH was specified, that would be very noticeable indeed. But within a window of 0.44 and 0.5 would be minimal. But Left and Right matching of components is not a bad idea.
L2 1mH is to most sensitive closely followed by L3 0.82mH and both 5% is good - L1 can tolerate 10%.
Cheers.
Joe R.
No worries, Francois.
For your information and to other users or constructors.
THE FUTURE OF THE ELSINORES MAY WELL INCLUDE A WAVEGUIDE - MARK 5
BTW, you will be building the Mark IV (4) Version. But some time in the future there will be a Mark 5 Version. When I say in the future there really is no set time. But all previous versions of Elsinores have been able to be updated, even if you have Mark 1 it can be made into 4, and the same for Mark 5 in the future. This upgrade ability has always been a plus for this design and aim to keep it that way.
If it does happen we will be producing a waveguide that goes into the existing space where the felt is currently fitted. Even a 18-20mm waveguide has significant advantages and I have just done another speaker system using a waveguide and I am definitely sold on the idea. But don't let that deter you from going ahead exactly as you are doing. The waveguide will eventually be sold to those who want the Mark 5 - the cost will be largely be decided by the guy who will be making them for me. The crossover will also needs some changes to be done, but only the part that crosses over to the Tweeter - this will need to be computer modelled as all changes are.
Cheers.
Joe R.
Mark 5 on the way...
Just dropping a quick line, a prototype shallow waveguide is definitely being developed and thanks to Steve the Z Man for making it possible using skills that I don't have. The waveguide will fit inside the tweeter cavity in place of the felt. Some changes will also be required to the crossover.
If this all becomes successful, and I am quite confident it will, then the idea is that the manufactured ready to fit waveguides will be sold in pairs, unless you can find the means to do it yourself. The dimensions and design will be published for those making their own.
As has always been the case, earlier Elsinores can be upgraded - that has always been the plan from the very inception.
Cheers.
Joe R.
Just dropping a quick line, a prototype shallow waveguide is definitely being developed and thanks to Steve the Z Man for making it possible using skills that I don't have. The waveguide will fit inside the tweeter cavity in place of the felt. Some changes will also be required to the crossover.
If this all becomes successful, and I am quite confident it will, then the idea is that the manufactured ready to fit waveguides will be sold in pairs, unless you can find the means to do it yourself. The dimensions and design will be published for those making their own.
As has always been the case, earlier Elsinores can be upgraded - that has always been the plan from the very inception.
Cheers.
Joe R.
I have sufficient left overs which I could let you have at cost - send me PM and we could see if it would be feasible to mail it to you from where I am in Illinois.
Francois
I found a 3 inch slip coupling at an electrical supply wholesaler. It is scepter brand (made in Canada) and is used for plastic electrical conduit. This coupling has an ID of about 89mm with a length of about 87mm.
A couple issues though,
1. It is a slip coupling so you need to file the down the ring in the middle where the pipe meets, and
2. The O.D. is 102mm so you need to file down the outside circumference 2mm on one end for a length of 1 inch, to fit it. ( and need to insert it from inside the cabinet)
I used a rasp file first, and then finished with a less aggressive one; took about 10 min a coupling.
My brother and I fired up the Mark 3 elsinores for the first time last night (slowly put them together throughout the last 9 months) and could not turn them off!!!!! The build was so well worth the effort. I will post more details and pics when I finish sewing the tweeter felts together.
Thanks Joe