I'm also eager to follow the progress of the "Hamlet", as I have recently hired a carpenter to build the Elsinore cabinets with a special birch finish (sorry, the norwegian-english dictionary didn't have the translation for "flammebjørk"...) 
Having a matching centre channel would be great as I believe my current PSB C60 will be a gross mismatch with the Elsinores (and I need a solid stand for my 52" Samsung
). If there is a 99% likelihood that the current cabinet drawings from page 4 will work fine, I'm all set to go. Guess the X-over design might change before the Hamlet project is finalized, but I'll follow the progress here closely. Keep up the good work, fellas..!! 
Having a matching centre channel would be great as I believe my current PSB C60 will be a gross mismatch with the Elsinores (and I need a solid stand for my 52" Samsung
). If there is a 99% likelihood that the current cabinet drawings from page 4 will work fine, I'm all set to go. Guess the X-over design might change before the Hamlet project is finalized, but I'll follow the progress here closely. Keep up the good work, fellas..!! I am confused, will the Hamlet center channel speaker be a horizontal MTM, or a BMTMB? Since both have been under discussion recently, I am unsure. I personally am hoping for the bmtmb, since A) I would like to have a large and dynamic center to match the Elsinores that I am starting to build, and B) because I think that I could learn a lot at how the crossover is changed to accomodate the same drivers in a different orientation.
An idea I had was that one could make a square center channel with a vertically arrayed MTM, and then place the bass-reinforcing midwoofers to the sides of the tweeter. A diamond shaped arrangement on a squarish (or wider) baffle. The idea is that you still have a somewhat compact speaker, but minimal comb filtering, since hopefully the bass speakers would be close enough to one another as to not nullify one another significantly. Does that make any sense?
Looking forward to the latest developments!!
An idea I had was that one could make a square center channel with a vertically arrayed MTM, and then place the bass-reinforcing midwoofers to the sides of the tweeter. A diamond shaped arrangement on a squarish (or wider) baffle. The idea is that you still have a somewhat compact speaker, but minimal comb filtering, since hopefully the bass speakers would be close enough to one another as to not nullify one another significantly. Does that make any sense?
Looking forward to the latest developments!!
mantraxl said:
Definitely MTM as seen post 60:
www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1184401#post1184401
This would be suitable for centre channel and rear channels, indeed all round it preferred. That means that Elsinore and Hamlet speakers can be used flexibly in multi-channel and AV situs.
Other than that, there is nothing proposed. Not until at least the Hamlet is done.
Joe R.
Some pics of my Elsinore Do you like them?
From left to right on the table AMC 2030 amp, in the center Vincent preamp, Nad CDP Onkyo CDP, on the left Hafler amp over DB Technologies MT530 amp.
This is the external crossover box. I want to cover it with plexiglass.
I wanted to use more highend component, but in the end the cheap side of me prevailed. I'll try in the future a better tweeter resistor than MOX I used; however MOX resistor are normally used in "highend" kit published in hifi magazines, so they must be not so bad.
I have calm my room, I read your article Joe that features triangles and strips, yes for sure they're effective but they aren't the nicest thing in the world to furnish the room, unless they have the name of a famous designer on it
A large bookshelf behind the speakers and heavy drapery could do the job?
In the last post I forgot to mention:
The sound coming out the Elsinores has also a great "vertical dimension" wich add a lot to the perception of the soundstage.
Do you like them?An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
From left to right on the table AMC 2030 amp, in the center Vincent preamp, Nad CDP Onkyo CDP, on the left Hafler amp over DB Technologies MT530 amp.
This is the external crossover box. I want to cover it with plexiglass.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I wanted to use more highend component, but in the end the cheap side of me prevailed. I'll try in the future a better tweeter resistor than MOX I used; however MOX resistor are normally used in "highend" kit published in hifi magazines, so they must be not so bad.
I have calm my room, I read your article Joe that features triangles and strips, yes for sure they're effective but they aren't the nicest thing in the world to furnish the room, unless they have the name of a famous designer on it
A large bookshelf behind the speakers and heavy drapery could do the job?
In the last post I forgot to mention:
The sound coming out the Elsinores has also a great "vertical dimension" wich add a lot to the perception of the soundstage.
The only resistor that are significantly better than the good old white cement is the DCA grafite, but its only to be used fore tweeter series resistor
I can see the biggest cap is 68uf, so theres no need to use polar, as its a commonly used size in bipolar...I would change that polar cap to a poly bipolar
Thread wire coils are perfectly fine and probably even better than the popular foil coils...but I would only use a good quality that are baked and without the plastic reel, could be from Jantzen
If you have a wire coil with iron powder core, its best to use a toroid cross coil instead
But you are right, theres no need fore any fancy stuff
I notice that all components used are all standard values, and believe it or not, it really does make a significant difference...so please never use paralelled components
The green cap, the 68uf , is already bipolar, a so called "smooth" bipolar.
All coils I used are varnish baked, except the 8.2mh and the 1.8mh used in LCR circuit.
yeah but they're more expensive. Do you mean toroid coil like "Torobar" from Intertechnik?
Actually the 8.2mh coil material is aronite, don't ask me what it is, but it should have lower distortion than the normal iron.
Now i have to sell some speaker, because I don't need them anymore with the new Elsinores. But I'm also thinking to design something small for the radio in my garage, but I see that designing compact things with good bass and efficiency is an hard task.
nitronori said:
Mistake on my part about the 68uf...I should have said "poly", not bipolar
Torobar may be ok, not sure
I was thinking of Jantzen or DCA(discontinued ?)
They have the advantage of less radiation, and low resistance, and maybe most important, low distortion
but it seems like that a higher resistant inductor has been designed into the xo, which means that a very low resistant coil may not be better, it depends
If you are satisfied with how it sounds now, theres no need to change anything
Attachments
nitronori said:
Less vibrations for sure. But I have nothing against those going the internal route. My main purpose: Easy to change and/or upgrade.
nitronori [B] The Elsinore speaker is clearly designed for valve amplifier... [/B][/QUOTE] Absolutely!!! :) [QUOTE][B] 1)What is exactly the function of the feld around the tweeter? [/B][/QUOTE] Lower diffraction distortion. This is quite measurable and without it the FR becomes rather ragged. It also gives a bit of a wave guide effect. This improves power handling of the tweeter further and also firms up the off axis response. Earlier the waveguide was more prominent (Mark 1 and 2) but that had to be sacrificed for better time alignment of drivers. I have since been drawn attention to the Lipinski L707 speakers said:
I honestly can't think of any.
nitronori said:
I have quite a bit about the theory behind it and I remain a bit unconvinced, even though it has been championed by some whom I have respect for.
I did look at modifying the crossover values sometimes back, to see what gave a so-called BBC dip. But I suspect that many speakers just have a bit too much energy in the lower treble band and presence region. It gives a more commercial or over etched sound? Is the BBC dip simply an over-reaction to that? I have deliberately avoided that and indeed set up a listening panel of four to get that right (there are many things behind the Elsinore design development that has not been revealed in full, otherwise it might take a thousand pages).
If you wish, decrease the 4.7uF tweeter series cap value to 3.9uF and even 3.3uF - this will go a long way towards that BBC dip. My feeling is that it is not needed unless you have a room on the bright side. But then again personal preferences might rule.
nitronori said:
It's been both a pleasure and a pain.
Joe R.
David Gatti said:
Take a look at this post:
www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1161906#post1161906
Focus on the Vifa XT25 Tweeter - incredibly flat ON axis (reputably goes up to 40KHz), but how the OFF axis response is dreadful (almost -20dB @ 20KHz).
I used this tweeter in Mark 1 version of the Elsinores with waveguide. The OFF axis response was hugely improved by the waveguide. Others have noted this as well. Indeed I mentioned the Lipinski L707 earlier that also uses XT25 and has been measured with an improved OFF axis response.
The HDS tweeter is a very different kettle of fish. If you haven't read the whole thread, you might find it interesting, starting here:
www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=97922&perpage=25&pagenumber=1
Joe R.
tweeter issues
Hi all,
Just finished building my Elsinores (except the crossovers)
During testing one of the tweeters did not work...
I sealed the hole with silicon...
I guessed maybe i overheated the tiny terminal for the voice coil connection. so i had to open the tweeter
The HDS tweeter is locked tight.... the threads were so tight with glue I twisted three allen keys undoing them....
The build quality is good at least !!!! any how I re soldered the tiny (hair like) voice coil wire and it was good to go. see pic
The moral of my little story is i wanted to let other constructors know that the tweeter terminals need to be soldered quite quickly so as not to damage the coil wiring. so no one else has this mistake.
-Dan
Hi all,
Just finished building my Elsinores (except the crossovers)
During testing one of the tweeters did not work...
I sealed the hole with silicon...
I guessed maybe i overheated the tiny terminal for the voice coil connection. so i had to open the tweeter
The HDS tweeter is locked tight.... the threads were so tight with glue I twisted three allen keys undoing them....
The build quality is good at least !!!! any how I re soldered the tiny (hair like) voice coil wire and it was good to go. see pic
The moral of my little story is i wanted to let other constructors know that the tweeter terminals need to be soldered quite quickly so as not to damage the coil wiring. so no one else has this mistake.
-Dan
