-experience.
It's usually something that happens just (within an octave) below the "bounding" freq. for the tunnel. (..though you rarely see problems at that point - or just above 2 kHz in this instance.) You'll often get some minor deviation a further octave below that. "Resonance" was a poor choice of word on my part.
Diffraction would be a better term.Above it you'll typically see some minor "waffling" in the freq. response from reflections - this can be subjectively worse (despite often averaging less than .5db deviation) than what's happening below depending on the diaphragm of the driver and the low-pass filter.
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-experience.
It's usually something that happens just (within an octave) below the "bounding" freq. for the tunnel. (..though you rarely see problems at that point - or just above 2 kHz in this instance.) You'll often get some minor deviation a further octave below that. "Resonance" was a poor choice of word on my part.
Above it you'll typically see some minor "waffling" in the freq. response from reflections - this can be subjectively worse (despite often averaging less than .5db deviation) than what's happening below depending on the diaphragm of the driver and the low-pass filter.
Hmm, I am not sure I get this. I don't see how diffraction fits in here, and I don't understand what the "bounding" frequency might be. Can you explain what's going on in the "tunnel"?
Hello Everyone,
I trust you're all safe & well in these crazy times.
I've read the last 100 or so pages & whilst I kinda understand the concept, but can someone please explain the theory behind this speaker design in "laymans" terms so I get a better handle on this?
I may entertain the idea of making my own pair as we seem to have a bit of time on our hands but I just need to better understand the design concepts.
In terms of the physical construction, I will approach William at Adelaide Speakers to commission the cabinetry & of I have very clear instructions on wiring the crossovers then I'm happy to give this a crack but I just need for all of this info to click 1st.
Cheers from the beautiful Adelaide Hills
Matt
I trust you're all safe & well in these crazy times.
I've read the last 100 or so pages & whilst I kinda understand the concept, but can someone please explain the theory behind this speaker design in "laymans" terms so I get a better handle on this?
I may entertain the idea of making my own pair as we seem to have a bit of time on our hands but I just need to better understand the design concepts.
In terms of the physical construction, I will approach William at Adelaide Speakers to commission the cabinetry & of I have very clear instructions on wiring the crossovers then I'm happy to give this a crack but I just need for all of this info to click 1st.
Cheers from the beautiful Adelaide Hills
Matt
Yes, I will certainly ask Bob Berner if he wants to make a flat pack, if I decide to move on this. Right now I’m just trying to find out what kits for the Elsinore Project, if any, are currently in existence for US customers. Both electronic/driver and cabinet. Neither Madisound, Meniscus, nor DIYsoundGroup have anything. Given how much interest I see here, I’m surprised I haven’t been able to find a kit anywhere but Australia. If these speakers compete with the world’s best, regardless of cost, one would think someone would have put a kit together.
Bob has certainly done fabulous jobs for me so far. I’m hoping I can encourage others to buy a Halcyon kit, or a FrugelHorn, or an Elsinore, or anything else, if he’s so inclined. You won’t be disappointed. But if something’s already out there, that would be good information to have. I’m sure he would want to know too.
Bob has certainly done fabulous jobs for me so far. I’m hoping I can encourage others to buy a Halcyon kit, or a FrugelHorn, or an Elsinore, or anything else, if he’s so inclined. You won’t be disappointed. But if something’s already out there, that would be good information to have. I’m sure he would want to know too.
There's no ready made kit. I had help from a diyaudio member picking xover parts and another member assembled them for me (I'm pretty lost on the xover stuff). I'd love to see a cabinet kit. The biggest problem in the US is the 1" material specified in Joe's construction diagrams. Love to see a suitable cabinet re-design based on 3/4" material everywhere that would keep Joe's goals intact.
I have alpair 10p on my drawer that can be built into FrugalHornXL or Halycon with same SBA driver for Elsinore but i'm sure Elsinore will be much better option to built.
Matt you have come to the wrong place for a layman's terms.Usually explanations turn into a **** storm of techno-babble!
The best I can make of it is that they are speakers that represent a benign electrical load so they should remove most of the problems that you can encounter from amplifier/speaker matching.And having owned a huge number of speakers and quite a number of amplifiers that variable cannot be understated. That is something that really should have been sorted by major speaker makers a long time ago but if anything modern speakers have become more difficult loads and therefore more subject to that variable.
So the Elsinores are a statement in how speakers should be but are generally not.
Of course there are other variables such as speaker/room interaction which are also important.
Elsinore Flat packs
Howdy, I am generally happy to cut any flat packs for people. Right now, it is difficult to do anything but think, plan, and design as I am locked out of my shop space with my CNC. Send me an email at bob@bigwoodstudio.net and/or visit my website to discuss details.
My supplier theoretically carries 25mm BB ply, at least it is in his catalog but I can't call to confirm or get accurate pricing because they are closed for the week, at least that's the latest. And if I can't get 25mm, and that is critical, I can make double 12mm panels.
And just one more note, I have a reliable and easy source for Okume. I've cut some boat parts out of it for a colleague, but have not yet used it for speaker cabinets. The material cost is much higher, but shipping costs on the kits would be lower.
Have a great day, stay safe and well!!
Howdy, I am generally happy to cut any flat packs for people. Right now, it is difficult to do anything but think, plan, and design as I am locked out of my shop space with my CNC. Send me an email at bob@bigwoodstudio.net and/or visit my website to discuss details.
My supplier theoretically carries 25mm BB ply, at least it is in his catalog but I can't call to confirm or get accurate pricing because they are closed for the week, at least that's the latest. And if I can't get 25mm, and that is critical, I can make double 12mm panels.
And just one more note, I have a reliable and easy source for Okume. I've cut some boat parts out of it for a colleague, but have not yet used it for speaker cabinets. The material cost is much higher, but shipping costs on the kits would be lower.
Have a great day, stay safe and well!!
Two very different loudspeakers with quite different choices of compromises.
FHXL is about an order of magnitude cheaper and the FR means there is no XO to get in the way. It will do some things better than Elsinore and visa vesa.
I do have something tickling my mind that builds on some of the ideas that Elsinore brings, but makes some compromises in the direction of a good FR speaker.
dave
To my mind, the biggest thing Elsinore brings to the table, that is rarely seen in other speakers, is its flat impedance response.
dave
Comparison
Well Alan Huth should be able to tell us the difference in how the FHXL sounds compared to the Halcyon. If he ever finishes the Halcyons that is.
Well Alan Huth should be able to tell us the difference in how the FHXL sounds compared to the Halcyon. If he ever finishes the Halcyons that is.
I’ll have to look that stuff up. Simialrily the stranded bamboo plywood is much pricier, but would cost more to ship — along with the superb panel performance it is very dense (not an asset unless it brings more stiffness to the table which it does in spades). I expect teh 18m would give performance simialr to good 25mm ply (or thicker even) and if the joinery is done well one can get some quite nice cosmetic touches and only needs a clear coat finish.
An example:
dave
An exotic plywood. The pictures i found suggest that the number of plies is not as high as in quality plywood like MurphyPly, usually a metric to use to generalize performance. Does anyone have a quick link to its physical properties, but from the description this is probably available in a wide range of quality.
How tuff is the outher surface? The bamboo ply seems almost like steel, very hard to ding. We have used Western Red Cedar, which turns out to be a very good speaker building material but the surface is soft and easily dented — i have yet to experiment with coatings (perhaps pentrating epoxy) that would overcome that.
dave
But only from his perspective, including the compromises he has the easiest time dealing with and the associated kit that he is using.
dave